I just can't take his academic preference rhetoric seriously if he considers Alabama, let alone goes there.
Abrupt Shift in Crystal Ball projections for Hand (To Bama)
I've learned to never take it seriously when a prospect says academics are a top preference. They all say that.
And on that note, though not on the same topic, DeShone Kizer (2014 QB from Toledo) just committed to ND.
Ohio State is running out of QB prospects. Urban is going to have to start looking at some prospects that "just aren't a good fit for Ohio State".
will just flip them all!
Mike Farrell tweeting today about feeling Hand to UM...I'll take that over the Crystal Ball any day. The guy is usually right and seems to only speak when he has extremely credible info.
For the record, I'm aware of that: I'm not saying he's wrong, I'm not saying the sky is falling, I'm not saying he's going to Bama. I simply thought this was of note. It simply seemed like an anomoly, six predictions that way in the last hour. It WAS the sort of strange, en masse shift that preceded Chase to Michigan. People can take it entirely for what it's worth.
Of course. Btw, I didn't take your post as the sky is falling. I agree, the predictor tool is of note. But just saying...I have no insider info or anything, beyond the recruiting sites, but Hand just feels UM-bound, even if it is still a process. Reminds me of Derrick Green, post his visit.
I think he only seems UM-bound is you're plugging your ears and going LALALA. Not saying he's not, but I think at best it's been like 51/49 Michigan v VT and now 6 insider guys all picked Bama within an hour or two of each other. Obviously there is some new information out there leading people to think he's going to Bama
If Bama calls, people are going to listen. We're fooling ourselves if we don't think this will be a competition until the very end for the #1 recruit in the nation. I mean, what the hell did we expect? We can't be DB's like Ohio State fans who can't seem to fathom that there would be other programs that top recruits would be interested in besides theirs.
and going in the first round, it is very difficult to not consider Alabama,very striongly, whatever we think of Saban. In fact, from a football ONLY perspective, it's tough to argue with them.
I have to disagree. He had an amazing visit to UM, said UM has his favorite coaching staff, raved about the food in A2 (and he's said in numerous interviews that will be a factor) and fully said he's looking at sports management after having met the dean of that program at UM (therefore, essentially dropping engineering). It's not ear-plugging as much as an educated guess. As far as VT, they don't have his preferred major, and he has said that's a major factor. Which is why I've personally felt confident. Not saying he's a lock, but post Hand's visit, I felt more confident about him than even Peppers after his.
that most of us tend to only read Michigan blogs / boards / forums and perhaps only really listen to 'insider info' we want to hear and thus get a very rosy outlook on a lot of guys. Maybe it's just me, but I'm not reading posts on all the VT and Bama boards where they are probably about equally as optimistic as we are.
So no doubt, Hand has said a lot of great things about Michigan. But I'm sure a few other teams have pretty rosy quotes they're drooling over as well
Mike Farrell knows,plus when was the last time HAND mention bama?
I still love the reaction when OSU is mentioned
I said this in the other thread and was flame-baited to death but VT is no longer in the running for his services. He told Bud Foster this today. He is focusing on Michigan, Florida, and Bama. Hence, The reason for the Michigan/Bama speculation. I know this because I have a friend in his "inner circle" who told me this.
Yeah, I'm not sure what that whole response was all about before. HOWEVA....do you think it's a good thing for Mich that VT is out? I know he's been to Bama once and it looks like he's planning another visit for late in the summer.
From what I hear he truly has no idea where he wants to go. I think it is going to be a hard battle with Bama for his services but do think we come out on top.
I led that charge in the other thread, and I mentioned this there, but I'm sorry about that. We've had a lot of people come through who claim to be insiders, make a prediction, and then sit quietly to see whether they should gloat about that prediction or fade away without anyone noticing. My sense is that you aren't one of those guys, and I wouldn't have been such a dick earlier if that had been my impression then. Sorry about that.
A question: By any chance, are you the guy who posted on Eleven Warriors about being with Hand (and wearing maize, I think) when he visited Columbus?
Not sure which visit you're talking about, but there's a different guy who posts here who said he was with Hand on his first visit to Ohio and I think also his visit to Mich.
Edit: His username is Canzior, and he provides good info on VA prospects.
Yeah he is my friend and who I got the info from. Please don't use this beyond info only as I got a little excited and took that information as only good news... without seeing the possibility of Bama being a strong contender.
No problem. I knew after I posted that many would think I was full of shit. I didn't want to divulge any more info on how I knew because I didn't know the whole story. It is funny that you apologized (with one p) after I said you would in the other thread. Haha! I would call BS on that as well with the background I gave. No hard feelings!
The check must have cleared.
Taking my post seriously is probably just as unwise.
If I saw a poster on RCMB or a guy on Twitter saying the same thing about one of our recruits I wouldn't take it as a joke.
I get the sense that agreeing with you right now, is unwise... But I totally am.
How and why do you have points? I know you're probably just using this account so people won't start wondering which other new account is yours but I'm watching you for the sake of the board and I will find your other accout.
/Man of Steeled
That is one first rate Indiana Jones reference right there
Poor guy. I really feel for you. You really must have nothing else going for you if you are spending all your time trolling a college football message board.
You're still here? Mods sleeping or what?
Are you looking for a rake fight or something?
Bama knows to always use cash. Checks are for amateurs.
you know Saban's good for it. Dude had a lighthouse for crap's sake.
But he is not. The 247Sports predictions seem to change all the time based on any little infor or interview. But they seem to only be really accurate right before a player is about to announce. If I remember correctly, most insiders had Winovich going to OSU until 24 hours before his announcement. Still a long way to go in this recruitment.
Hand is going to be courted to the end. Take it in stride - there's a long ways to NSD.
JC Shurburtt, 3 'Bama Insiders, 247's national director of scouting, and a guy from land-grant holy land who I thought was not completely full of shit. All this afternoon.
That is a little concerning. But offset a bit by Mike Farrell. I'll resume a 50/50 assumption
Gerry Hamilton troll so hard. I wouldn't read too much into it.
I see it as one guy at the Alabama site feels confident about Hand (who knows if it is real sources or just a feeling from an interview), and the rest of these guys are just piggybacking off it. The Ohio State blogger doesn't have any inside info here, and that is what makes me more confident that this is just a bunch of people jumping on the bandwagon of someone else's lead.
Might've mentioned they could be his new leader or something. This happened right before Winovich committed, a whole gaggle of people predicted Michigan out of nowhere within 12 hours. I'd guess there's some legs to this
we started that and it was pretty obvious conclusion: no OSU visit means they're out and the Pitt stuff was obviously crap.
I posted this at our site, but will share that I know why JC/Bama guys switched their picks, but am keeping my pick for Michigan.
Can you tell us then? Or link us? That'd be great.
he'd be happy to
Reason: Driving clicks to 247 like no other.
Alternate Reason: Analysts gain points for how early they make a correct crystal ball prediction, and thus these guys are hoping to strike it rich knowing that they can always switch to Michigan/VT at a later date.
I think it is a great addition to your site, but the fact people can change their predictions so late takes some of the utility of it away. Someone breaks the commitment story, and a bunch of people who had it wrong change their prediction and get credit for for it.
If the predictions locked when a commitment story broke or commitment about to be made, it would provide readers more insight into whose predictions to follow/trust, and it would keep so many analysts from throwing out predictions for every recruit in the database even though they may know just as much about most of those recruits as the rest of us.
I think you are on the right track, but I feel like all "predictions" shouldn't take effect for 24 or 48 hours (or something like that). Otherwise, you get the Chase Winovich situation where everyone and their mother finds out the night before/day of announcement that the recruit is announcing for a certain school, and they all look equally smart in the rankings because they got it correct. Thus, they should only count predictions that are made when they are predictions, not reactions to late-breaking news (like you said).
Yeah they really need to revamp that system. Their CEO, who basically has picks in on every person that a lot of his analysts picked a while ago, has an average of 5 days of being correct. So on average his gues is right for 5 days before the recruit commits. That's pretty stupid and useless when the recruiitng process is 2 or 3 years long for some players.
It seems like you're missing the point... Why would they want you to think some of their reporters aren't trustworthy or have bad connections? You're supposed to be focused on the general consensus of where the guy is going, not on the analysts. Things change regularly in recruiting, so the predictions change. I don't understand why you would care if they change their predictions.
There is no "consensus." Everyone just changes their prediction minutes after commitment news breaks from one of the true insiders for that recruit. For me, I want to see the predictions from the people who are actually plugged in (the guys from the sites or region who are talking to that prospect and know him). Who cares what some guy from Minnesota's blog thinks where Hand is going? Most of these people are only making their picks based on off what one insider is picking. That is not a consensus. That is just 10 people piggybacking off someone else and it skews the results.
If the predictions locked at the right time (when the commitment news broke), it would force the analysts and bloggers to only pick on the prospects that they have some actual knowledge about. And then you would get a true consensus.
I think tracking the accuracy of analysts is as much for them as it is for the readers. Analysts would stop putting predictions in for recruits they know nothing about.
It seems like you're making a separate argument now. I'm in total agreement about trying to limit piggybacking, but that doesn't change the fact that recruits change their minds and the analysts get new insider information based off shifts in a player's recruitment. If they were never allowed to change their predictions, they'd be totally useless.
He saying there should be a point at which the prediction shouldn't be able to be changed. If I'm an analyst and I change my prediction every time the wind blows but at the very last minute I hear from a reliable source that the recruit is picking team x and I'm right how good am I at forecasting where a recruit is going?
Maybe you can't lock in a prediction at a certain point, but there should be some mechanism to show which analysts actually are decent at this and not just chaning their predictions every time a guy takes a visit or eats a certain lunch...
Maybe during recruiting they could track the guys predicitons and in hindsight show how many times each "guru" changed his prediction and for how long he was actually right and give them a grade or something. I don't know the answer, but I agree with the point he's making. If I knew a guy changed his predictions on average 30 times per recruit and had a poor success rate I would take his view less serious than say a guy who changed his 10 times and had a good sucess rate.
Too bad they're not allowed to actually bet money with each other. Not much to lose otherwise.
Is there a "Hold me Steve L" meme? Now there is.
I bet... even Hand doesn't know where Hand is going. His mind probably changed regularly. He might be a freak of athletic nature, but he's also freakin' 17 or 18 or whatever. He's got everyone in his ear. So none of these predictions are worth the cost of the air they're spoken with. That's my 2 cents.
I agree with that. We often try to piece together info on where a player wants to go basically based on the assumption that they already know. I think we forget they usually don't know, which is why they didn't commit anywhere yet
When it's June before your Senior year in high school and you can go to any school in the country, you probably shouldn't know. That's what the research and visits are for.
from Michigan fer God sakes
Ah TheGhostofBlank. Frequently wrong, no consequences for bad posts, and a huge generator of flamebait. Sounds about right.
-1 to TGOF
I think some of it has to contribute from the vibe that VaTech may have fallen off a bit which also could have been a reason Farrell changed from them to Michigan.
Might have been inside info he knew about the bama visit, and refers to him knowing everyone was going to switch to bama, goes out on an "educated guess" limb and picks Michigan?
It's amusing that the lack of news on the MGoBoard has been replaced by instantaneous projections for Hand's school.
Three were Alabama sites, and one was from an Ohio State site, I know that shouldn't mean anything, but I just thought I'd put that out there.
I don't like this news at all and wish to change the subject. Let's talk about subs or something.
Alabama makes horrible subs.
Lets not get crazy.
There are good reasons to go to Alabama, whether we like it or not, and there are good reasons to go to other schools too. It's a long way to signing day.
Darius West committed to Kentucky last night without a planned announcement. Take a look at some of the analysts who got caught offguard and were not able to change their predictions (3 of them just predicted Hand to Alabama):
another midwest based four star choosing KENTUCKY over a Big Ten school. Embarassing
But . . . but . . . but . . . they play in the SEC!
Their empty seats are much faster than other conferences' empty seats.
They must be doing a killer job of selling S-E-C! because what in the world else do you sell Kentucky football on?
"You can watch good basketball in your free time. Come to Kentucky"
When you say "selling" SEC...
Alabam is still third behind Tech and Michigan. It's not like they are suddenly in the lead. People are reading way to into this. But 24/7 got their page clicks.
Unfortunately, Da'Shawn hands choice of school is not based on the democratic process. If 6 consecutive guys suddenly pick Alabama, it's probably safe to assume they're in 1st or 2nd right now
Is that he is dropping VT from his top group. The flipped crystal ball predictions are all from VT to AL, so we're just in a battle with a new suitor. Call me crazy, but I still like our chances
Based on our experiences in 2011 and 2012, I'd rather battle with VT.
Has Alabama hired Bud Foster or something?
Roll Damn Tide said that his offer to 'Bama was not committable.
Now, personally, while I lived very close to Maize and Blue deli, I still think that Zingerman's product was superior.
247 is awful. They couldn't pay me to join. Besides the fact that their goofy crystal ball feature is hilariously wrong all the time. Nice insiderz.
still has a better shot according to the crystal ball.
I am glad that DaShawn chose his official visit for UTL 2. I've never been to a night game at the Big House but I could feel the energy and emotion through the tv. That atmosphere along with commits in his ear will go a long way.
UTL was awesome! Loudest I have ever heard the stadium and I have had season tickets since 1995.
Show up big time for that game, and give Hand a taste of what our D will be like with him, Peppers, and Jackson for UTL3 or 4. Assuming they still call it UTL since we won't be playing The Domers at night anymore.
Until Hand himself says something, I wouldn't go crazy over this. The crystal ball has been known to be wrong before. They all predict to one school, the recruit picks another, then they all switch their predictions on the day of the announcement. One of the big predictors over there changed his Peppers prediction to Rutgers days before the announcement as well (possibly for clicks..)
is big on academics. Alabama is not a great academic school so i think this is BS
Hey be nice! They teach cursive and multiplication there.
well if i am not mistaken he just visited alabama and hasnt had a chance to actually let it sink in yet like most recruits he probably told all these guys who made the predicitions that his visit was amazing and bama may have joined the top group with may have being the key words i really dont think a guy who has preached all along that academics and atmospere can honestly pick bama over mich or Vt plus he said that the mich coaches are his favorite and until i hear that come out of his mouth about bama i will just assume he enjoyed his visit and nothing more
I couldn't agree more bama is just the most recent visit and sure he's going to be excited but most recruits are excited after almost every visit so yeah I wouldn't get too excited about the crystal ball picks if he commits to bama then I'll get excited until then i won't let's all just take a deep breath and wait until he announces no matter which team he picks I'll wish him the best of luck
no punctuation meme starting?
no because you just fucked it up
I am so sorry the last thing I wanted to do was fuck up a budding meme that would be a tragedy of epic proportions I couldn't even fathom at this point or any other
That is one of the longest sentences I have ever seen. Seriously, I'm not one who enjoys the grammar police and such, but that was incredible.
I think 24/7 caught onto Rivals and just started spewing speculative nonsense to get clicks.
I feel everything points to him dropping VT, which would pit us vs. bama. It sounds like good news, but I have a feeling he dropped VT because his bama visit was that good. Anyway, it seems the info will get out soon enough, people are saying.
What is all of this Hand talk? Can't we get back to sandwiches? Maybe burritos? That may be something we all actually have a background in versus opinion. If I were Da'shawn hand, one day I would wearca Michigan hat, the next day tweet about BGSU, the next a Miami (YTM)..... I would love to watch the blogs and experts erupt!
I'm gonna get to the bottom of this Crystal Ball nonsense!
Paging Miss Cleo.....
Do any of you even take the crystal ball seriously anymore? There have been guys who had 100% predictions for a school go somewhere completely different. I like 247 but the crystal ball bs is worthless.
Hand has a general interest in the University of Michigan! Hoke and his coaches have a good chance of reeling him in. I'm just excited that we are one of the top schools on his list. I think he will be more of a standout DE star playing for Michigan. I have a feeling Hand will wait until the end of the 2013 season before he makes his final decision.
Hand hasn't given any indication of who's leading or where he wants to go. For all we know, it could be State. Haha, I know, that one's laughable and only in Sparty's dreams, but you get the idea. I think Michigan has just as good a chance at landing him as Alabama does, if not a better one.
He might be leaning towards Alabama, and even if he is, who cares? We've got a great class with or without him.
This class would be Epic.
True, my point is that the class is already pretty damn talented, and I have no doubt we're adding more of it with or without Hand. Something tells me that when signing day rolls around, we won't have just one five star, or even just two depending on if Malik commits and gets a fifth star. Which is looking better and better by the day.
Were on the same page brother. But him and McDowell on the same line, Jebus h. Cripes! Not to mention Jackson and Peppers in the backfield, that combination alone has to be huge factor on his mind. My guess is if those dominoes fall in Michigan's favor, then Hand joins this class. If not, then its 50/50 till signing day.
24/7 pumps out info at a ridiculous rate. Noticed this for awhile now. Can't imagine it's all fact based, sure there is a lot of speculation posts with VIP attached to it for credibility.
Sounds like a classic case of quantity over quality.
Foster today that VT is out. Some go beyond that to say he will officially narrow down to 3 schools - with those being FLA, AL, and M. The "VT is out" stuff seems to be confirmed by the (few) non-VIP posts about hand on the 247 VT site.
I'll take that as good news. I suppose it's better to be in someone's top 3 vice top 5..plus we are still the favorite staff and the favorite coach appears to be eliminated
gives Michigan a better chance in relation to VT. Obviously, Alabama is a real contender, but all that happened is some people picking VT switched to 'Bama, which isn't horrible. VT is the actual "home school" and one he may have a had the longest relationship with, so fewer people thinking he's going there means the recruitment process is probably more open, then it's just up for grabs.
Day trading can be both dangerous and profitibable, if you are good at following rumors.
I am surprised that anyone ever gets a recruit that Bama really wants. It's the major reason why I think players should be allowed to take money from whoever wants to pay them. It would level the playing field for teams that don't have six-figure golden handshakes and try to adhere to the rules.
Jesus, if you all weren't so young I'd suspect some of you have Alzheimers already. Have you all forgotten Myron Rolle? You know, the 5-star DB from NJ (ESPN's top HS player in the country for 2006) who wanted to go to medical school, which in the eyes of the UM faithful meant that there was no way he could choose anybody else than Michigan?
He went to Florida State, where he actually had a great academic career and is now in medical school after a very brief stint in the NFL.
I've got two degrees from UM so I'm never going to downgrade the institution, but solid people graduate from other universities every year—even MSU and OSU—and go on to do worthwhile things with their lives.
But let's not kid ourselves: his primary goal by far is to play in the NFL and make a shit-ton of money while doing so. As long as Saban is coaching in Tuscaloosa, Alabama will be a tremendously attractive destination for anybody with NFL dreams. To think otherwise is delusional.
I still think Michigan is in very good shape with Hand, but this is why I was not doing cartwheels over all the Farrell hoo-ha from earlier today. There's too much time until Hand's decision for anybody to think their school has him nailed.
Hoke & Co. deserve a gigantic amount of credit for getting Michigan as far as they have in Hand's consideration. Being in this situation (not to mention landing all the great recruits we have already) would have been a ridiculous pipe dream barely three years ago.
That's some REAL TALK right there, Don.
...to (without going to the Googles) name one graduate of an SEC school who went on to notable professional fame by virtue of their education.
I can name 10 from Michigan alone.
Not that I don't believe you, I just want to hear them.
I've got no Hand, Jerry! No Hand!
Didn't get Poggi.
Stay tough blue. We're still in this.
Can only be good news that the home team is out.
As long as Hand keeps his official for UTL2, I think Michigan is still in a good place.
Events of June 11, 2013
It was the 50th anniversary of Alabama Governor George Wallace standing in the doorway of Foster Auditorium at the University of Alabama, trying to block the entry of two students of color, Vivian Malone Jones and James Hood. It was Wallace’s reminder to the world that he would fight for "segregation now, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever" and stop the desegregation of schools.
Highly touted football recruit Da’Shawn Hand, reportedly hints that the frontrunner for his services is the University of Alabama, despite (a) his previous declaration of love and respect for Bud Foster, defensive coordinator for Virginia Tech University’s football team, the early frontrunner for Hand’s services, and (b) his previous declaration of love and respect for the University of Michigan’s football coaches.
The Times They Are A-Changing. Shake Me, Wake Me (When It’s Over.)
and I am not an english major either but I am having trouble seeing the irony here. I mean, is it simply that a guy stood in front of the doors of a university and didn't want black people in, and now a black guy wants to get in 50 years later? That doesn't really seem ironic to me unless the word is being very loosely applied (and I mean very losely). Maybe the word doesn't mean what i think it means.....
I’m neither an English major nor a humorist, so I’ll accept the failure of my previous post. This old man’s getting used to the more frequent negging on this Board. (Not that there’s anything right with that.) Sometimes I wonder whether there’s a moderator or poster who just down votes everything I post, as if I were being encouraged to just keep my thoughts to myself.
So, forgive me for possibly confusing irony with sarcasm – and apparently failing at both. I just found it somewhat strange that on the 50th anniversary of a dark day in the struggle for equal opportunity in this country, a story about Da’Shawn Hand’s recruitment would have shone a positive light on the University of Alabama, even though I recognize the progress made by the University of Alabama during the past 50 years.*
I suppose that mixing History and Irony with Ebony and Ivory, the 1982 song from Stevie Wonder and Paul McCartney, didn’t work as either irony or sarcasm. And I guess that I also failed by using The Four Tops’ Wake Me Shake Me (When It’s Over) to express my attitude about what may become more twists and turns in the saga of Da’Shawn Hand’s recruitment between now and National Signing Day in February 2014.
* I recall the events of June 11, 1963 at the University of Alabama, as well as the events of September 12, 1970 at Legion Field in Birmingham, Alabama when Clarence Davis scored twice and Sam Cunningham scored three touchdowns and rushed for 135 yards on 12 carries to lead USC to a 42-21 victory over the all-white Alabama football team. I also know that the most-recent U. S. News Racial Diversity Index for Michigan (.41) is not much higher than the racial diversity index for Alabama (.31). Link: http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities/campus-ethnic-diversity/page+7
According to rivals mike Da'Shawn hand has eliminated 2 schools from his top five! Don't know which 2 yet
Subway and Potbelly
Sam's assessment from talking directly to Hand numerous times is that Michigan is Deshawn's favorite staff. He stressed that Hand hasn't said that specifically to Sam, but that's his conclusion from the stuff Deshawn has said. Obviously that gives Michigan a significant advantage if that's an accurate picture of the situation. Sam also is skeptical that VaTech is truly out of the running at this point.
Sam said that when he first started looking at Hand a year or so ago he thought there was no way that Deshawn would come north, but that changed radically after Mattison visited Hand's school. Which is odd since we know that Mattison is only the 144th best recruiter in the country.
We're talking about the #1 player in the country. Of course the staff is gonna have to battle with Alabama and other national powers to secure a commitment. Additionally, I agree with what people said that he's inclined to be excited about his most recent visit.
He eliminated the hokies and the gamecocks...top three of Michigan, Bama, Florida...might take trips to LSU and USC ...per rivals mike ...sorry cant link twitter at work. I think it bodes well for us being in his ear so long and that he loves our staff, but if you were 17 and the best player in the country it would be hard not to take a look at Bama and all there rings and early draft picks.