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2014 Football Road Record

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:37 AM
#302
YaterSalad
YaterSalad's picture
Joined: 03/29/2010
MGoPoints: 949
I think the concept of "road

I think the concept of "road woes" is a myth for the most part ... Each year involves too many variables - new players, coaches, stadiums, fans, momentum. Two prime examples are ND (Denard had the worst performance of his career against them and we still had a chance) and Nebraska (Denard gets hurt). Things like that happen that skew the road record problem. Those same things can happen at home and losses ensue.



That being said, I think we correct some of our history this next year. I see us going 3-2 or 4-1. I think we beat ND and Sparty. But the loss is OSU is a definite maybe.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:46 AM
(Reply to #2) #303
GhostOfPosBang
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Joined: 10/25/2013
MGoPoints: 1217
I tend to disagree

One could easily make the argument that Denard had the worst performance of his career BECAUSE it was on the road.  If that game's in the Big House, we probably win.

Besides, players and coaches getting rattled in front of hostile crowds and unfamiliar ground is a very real concept.  You can't deny that.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:50 AM
(Reply to #11) #304
Tuebor
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Joined: 03/14/2011
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I'm with you.  We have had 4

I'm with you.  We have had 4 solid (as in we put the game away, not that they were great victories) road wins in the Hoke era.

2011 - @Northwestern and @Illinois

2012 - @Purdue and @Minnesota

The other road wins are from 2013 - a squeaker @UCONN and the luckiest field goal in the history of football @Northwestern.

 

This staff has not shown the ability to win big games on the road.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:27 AM
(Reply to #19) #305
HipsterCat
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Joined: 06/28/2011
MGoPoints: 2088
"This staff has not shown the

"This staff has not shown the ability to win big games on the road" is such bullshit. it's easier to win at home than on the road thats a fact. Is it hoke and borges fault denard threw 5 picks against notre dame last year? or got hurt against nebraska? or that TE missed the block against state on the 4th down conversion and then denard threw a pick the next drive?

sometimes the other team makes the plays and our plays dont its not always the staffs fault. against Iowa this year funchess gets the dropsies and cant catch anything stalling drives, morgan and ross both get hurt so iowa gets in the game and then gardner fumbles on the last drive when we are down 3 to lose it. sometimes especially on the road players make mistakes because they are kids. Most of these road games are close and the coaches and players put themselves in position to win but just couldnt quite get that last play they needed. It's not ncaa 14 where you can just quit and try again if you screw up and throw too many picks or you can just exploit the glitches in the AI and run the same plays down the field while the computer derps around. sometimes our players dont make the plays that they need to.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:37 AM
(Reply to #73) #306
Tuebor
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Joined: 03/14/2011
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Here you go again with the

Here you go again with the execution argument.  It is Borges' fault for making Denard throw so damn much @ND in 2012.  We were moving the ball well on the ground.

 

Also the ability to win big games on the road is proven by winning them.  Not by blaming poor execution and injuries.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:05 PM
(Reply to #85) #307
HipsterCat
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Joined: 06/28/2011
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we rushed 41 times for 161

we rushed 41 times for 161 yards, 3.9 a carry with a fitz long of 31 and a denard long of 20, take those out and we were averaging 2.8yds a carry, i dont see any of that as a successful rushing attack. denard threw 24 times and had 4 picks but averaged 5.75 yards an attempt. thats a heavily run based attack but i guess borges should have gone all georgia southern and only thrown the ball like 3 times...

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:17 PM
(Reply to #108) #308
Tuebor
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You are fixating on game. 

You are fixating on one game.  Anecdotal evidence does not convey trends. 

 

I agree that we should have beaten ND in 2012, but we didn't.  Should have, would have, could have is not showing the ability to beat teams with winning records on the road.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 1:26 PM
(Reply to #85) #309
DealerCamel
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Joined: 07/25/2012
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The thing with Denard throwing @ ND

The thing is that for a lot of the game he was eviscerating Notre Dame's secondary with throws.  Big throw, big throw, big thr - oh crap, interception.  "Okay Denard, don't do that next time."  "Sure coach, no problem."  Big throw, big throw - crap, another pick.  And so on.

I don't blame the staff for making him throw it that much, honestly.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 1:27 PM
(Reply to #87) #310
Reader71
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Joined: 08/30/2009
MGoPoints: 22152
His gameplans are often

His gameplans are often better than you know.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 1:48 PM
(Reply to #134) #311
Tuebor
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Everygame plan looks great on

Everygame plan looks great on paper.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:17 PM
(Reply to #19) #312
The Crootin' Crouton
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Joined: 11/16/2013
MGoPoints: 269
I'm sick of the pessimism.

I'm sick of the pessimism.  Gardner will be a senior and we're not losing all that much. 5-0, book it.  I trust coach Hoke and the team, unlike most of you Debbie Downers.

 

Go Blue!

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:21 PM
(Reply to #112) #313
Tuebor
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Debbie Downer or realist?  I

Debbie Downer or realist?  I need to see more from this staff to build confidence in road games.  The breaks go for you and the breaks go against you in a season.  At the end you are what your record says you are.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 5:53 PM
(Reply to #114) #314
B1G_Fan
Joined: 10/11/2012
MGoPoints: 3269
 Notre Dame lost 1 starter

 Notre Dame lost 1 starter off their defense last year and we went from 9 points to 41 this year they lose alot more including Nix and Truitt. The only two time we lost in ND stadium the last 10 years or so we had a total of 13 turnovers. Richrods first year we had 7 and Denard senior year we had 6. Lets say i'm happily optimistic about our chances in south bend.

 With the exception of MSU and OSU road games our schedule is a creme puff.. come on seriously, we're at Rutger, at maryland and at Northwestern even at our worst this year we're 2-1 or 3-0 vs this.

 The funniest comment where about Everett Golson coming back. the last time we faced him at Notre Dame stadium he was pulled from the game for Tommy Reece. I'm expecting our defense to be much improved considering the ammount of true freshman and true sophmores we played this year.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:37 AM
#315
goblue20111
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Wins at Rutgers and NW though

Wins at Rutgers and NW though if we lost at NW somehow I wouldn't be shocked.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:38 AM
#316
The Baughz
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It looks likr 2-3 is a safe

It looks likr 2-3 is a safe bet. But who knows. So far road games have not been kind to Hoke and co.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:39 AM
#317
Lionsfan
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Joined: 06/03/2011
MGoPoints: 1961
OSU is a must win next year.

OSU is a must win next year. You can't start off 0-3 against Urban Meyer, with your only OSU win against a 6-6 team

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:57 AM
(Reply to #5) #318
unWavering
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Which makes the loss all the

Which makes the loss all the more frustrating. Ending their 23-0 run and being 1-1 vs Meyer would have been oh so sweet.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:39 AM
#319
brandon_lundberg
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Joined: 11/23/2009
MGoPoints: 2426
Well I predict a loss at

Well I predict a loss at Notre Dame as they will be better. MSU loses a lot and I expect to win this game because our defense will be better and likely stop their power attack. Ohio Predict Ohio loses Miller to NFL, Their OC hermann Leaves for new job. They have to replace 4 offensive lineman and carlos hyde, Jordan Hall, Kenny Guiton are all gone. Ohio will be 50/50 and we have a great shot to beat them.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:13 AM
(Reply to #6) #320
Felix.M.Blue
Joined: 10/22/2011
MGoPoints: 6126
ND

I'm not seeing ND being better. Isn't Day and Nix gone? 

All the other road games ya that will be dicey at best.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:26 AM
(Reply to #52) #321
Magnus
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Joined: 07/17/2008
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Day is a sophomore.

Day is a sophomore.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:50 AM
(Reply to #52) #322
WolvinLA2
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Joined: 11/13/2009
MGoPoints: 52761
They won't lose Day but

They won't lose Day but they'll likely lose Nix, Tuitt, Williams, Calabrese, Shembo and a handful of others. The Gholson situation will be interesting.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 1:11 PM
(Reply to #96) #323
Victor Hale II
Joined: 12/28/2011
MGoPoints: 8131
ND has been recruiting very

ND has been recruiting very well, so they might be able to plug some of those holes without too much of a problem. 

 

Totally with you on Golson.  He's a 2nd year starter, coming in after a year off from football, and he plays the most critical position in sports.  I like our chances there, especially with our D returning most of its contributors and maybe even adding a few more.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:40 AM
#324
swan flu
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Joined: 08/16/2010
MGoPoints: 8150
I'm oddly optimistic about

I'm oddly optimistic about next season.  We replace starters Thomas Gordon and Jabril Black on defense with Dymonte Thomas (probably) and Ondre Pipkins while keeping in tact a really really good linebacker core of Ryan, Morgan, and Ross.  Depth will be in our favor with guys like Ojemudia, Poggi, Stribling, and Gedeon all progressing.  Not to mention the addition of Jabrill Peppers. 

 

If we can avoid crippling injuries on defense, and if our offense can figure out how to gain some consistancy (that's the big 'if") then I really think we could win 4 of those road games and compete for the B1G title.

 

I think there's a good chance we turn the corner next year. I'll predict we lose to ND, but win the rest. 

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:44 AM
(Reply to #7) #325
aiglick
Joined: 11/27/2010
MGoPoints: 7860
Please be right.

Please be right.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:46 AM
(Reply to #7) #326
Tuebor
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Joined: 03/14/2011
MGoPoints: 15354
I like your optimism but

I like your optimism but Pipkins and Dymonte Thomas are unproven.  Big guys have trouble with knee injuries, just ask Chris Bryant.  Dymonte Thomas blocked a punt against CMU but has made no noise sense. 

 

Depth should be good but I'd like a strong first team at all Big Ten level not 1a and 1b.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:54 AM
(Reply to #12) #327
swan flu
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But MSU and OSU are making

But MSU and OSU are making replacements too.  The unproven argument is nullified because every team replaces people. Pipkins and Thomas were heavily praised by Mattison, and the consensus on Thomas was that he needed  year to improve his coverage, but that he was easily one of the best athletes on the team.  Pipkins was a starter this year before getting hurt.

 

Chris Bryant never received such praise and started the year behind TWO walk-ons. apples and oranges there.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:57 AM
(Reply to #23) #328
Tuebor
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Joined: 03/14/2011
MGoPoints: 15354
True, but my argument on

True, but my argument on Pipkins was based on the fact that large bodies don't recover as quickly from ACL injuries.  There is a chance Pipkins redshirts next season. 

 

 

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:02 AM
(Reply to #31) #329
swan flu
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Joined: 08/16/2010
MGoPoints: 8150
Ah yes I see that

Ah yes I see that now.

 

That's a fair point, but even with Pipkins out, our front 7 is going to be very very good.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:52 AM
(Reply to #37) #330
I Like Burgers
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Front 7

I do like the front 7 next season.  They lose Black and QWash, but everyone else returns.  The young guys will all be a year older, wiser, and stronger, plus they can start to rotate in some of the guys they redshirted this year like Poggi and McCray.

I think the overall success of the unit though hinges largely on Pipkins ability to bounce back from injury.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:59 AM
(Reply to #97) #331
Tuebor
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Joined: 03/14/2011
MGoPoints: 15354
Right now I see 2014 Michigan

Right now I see 2014 Michigan as 2012 MSU.  Strong defense but too one dimensional on offense (Passing for 2014 Michigan, Leveon Bell for 2012 MSU) to win more than 7 games.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:00 AM
(Reply to #23) #332
Double Nickel BG
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Joined: 02/04/2009
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Not so fast

On Bryant. There was rumblings last year and this year that Bryant was one of the better guards before he kept getting the owwies.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:03 AM
(Reply to #35) #333
swan flu
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Joined: 08/16/2010
MGoPoints: 8150
I believe what you are

I believe what you are referring to are the defensive linemen saying they were scared of him when he pulled because he packed a punch.  The coaches never said he was one of the better guards, and he was never higher on the depth chart than Glasgow or Burzynski.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:53 AM
(Reply to #38) #334
Double Nickel BG
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Joined: 02/04/2009
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Brian and others

Heard through sources that Bryant would have got a lot if run if not for his health.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:55 AM
(Reply to #12) #335
1 percent
1 percent's picture
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Yeah but every team is going

Yeah but every team is going to hade to replace someone with a relative unknown.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:15 AM
(Reply to #12) #336
EastUGoBlue
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Joined: 05/28/2012
MGoPoints: 181
Dymonte

Why didn't we just redshirt him if that's how he was going to be used? Everyone thought he was gonig to contribute. I still like him a lot, just odd how it turned out.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:26 AM
(Reply to #54) #337
swan flu
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Joined: 08/16/2010
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2 reasons:   1) Given his

2 reasons:

 

1) Given his unique athleticism, the coaches felt he was an asset on special teams, where athleticism is often the most important trait.

2) Mattison has stated in the past how Thomas will likely be an NFL player.  Perhaps the coaches felt it unlikely that he would stay 5 years, so why not get him on the field this year?

 

In my optimistic oppinion, the fact that Thomas played special teams this year but didn't start speaks more positively of him than if he had been redshirted and annointed as the future of the defensive backfield.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:55 AM
(Reply to #71) #338
I Like Burgers
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Actual game action helps too

Plus, if Thomas is going to be the safety of the future, getting him in some actual game action helps too.  Looking into the 2014 season, starting a safety who's never played a down of live college football isn't quite ideal.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:46 AM
(Reply to #7) #339
Bighouse1475
Joined: 08/28/2011
MGoPoints: 174
We'll beat the chickens

We'll beat the chickens

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:41 AM
#340
GoWings2008
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NW... away.

I knew that MSU was a road game two years in a row, but NW too?  I guess I wasn't paying good enough attention.  Not that it matters THAT much, they're more like home games anyway.  And upside, I live closer to there than AA and I can go again this year.

But the question still remains regarding scheduling.  Da faq?

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:14 AM
(Reply to #8) #341
Tuebor
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Indiana and Minnesota are

Indiana and Minnesota are both at Home again next year.  I can't believe that Dave Brandon let MSU and OSU venues get in sync.  It is all part of his master plan of raising the PSD every 2 years.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:42 AM
#342
sheepdog
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Miller will be gone.. This is

Miller will be gone.. This is being reported but just not confirmed yet

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:47 AM
(Reply to #9) #343
GoWings2008
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Source?

Source?

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:04 AM
(Reply to #14) #344
sheepdog
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Bucknut mods..

Bucknut mods..

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:47 AM
#345
TexanGOBLUE
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It has been said that Braxton

It has been said that Braxton has hit the ceiling in terms of accomplishments and wins. He might as well go to the NFL and become Troy Smith. I thought I read somewhere Urban thought Braxton wasn't ready for the NFL. This would come from Urban since he would be lost without his QB and the team would most likely become Florida without Tebow.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:57 AM
(Reply to #15) #346
Magnus
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I don't know... J.T. Barrett

I don't know... J.T. Barrett will be a redshirt freshman next year, but he was a pretty good player in high school. He sat out this year partly because of a knee injury. 

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:25 AM
(Reply to #32) #347
MattisonMan
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They're definitely okay with

They're definitely okay with Guiton:

SPLITS CMP ATT YDS CMP% YPA LNG TD INT SACK RAT
Season 75 109 749 68.8 6.87 90 14 2 1 165.2

*EDIT: I had no earthly idea that he was a senior.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:27 AM
(Reply to #32) #348
GoWings2008
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I hear from my ohio contacts

I hear from my ohio contacts that everyone likes Cardale Jones, the presumed replacement.  We'll see though. 

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:39 PM
(Reply to #74) #349
Evil Empire
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If if if this happens, I would be very confident

Of course he'd have the year to improve, but Jones is Gardner without the intelligence or throwing ability.  Even on the road I think we can contain someone like Jones.  Sophomore Braxton Miller >Junior Braxton Miller >>> Freshman Braxton Miller.  Even if Miller has reached his peak he still tore us up. 

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:47 AM
#350
The Dirty Nil
Joined: 05/13/2012
MGoPoints: 5703
I hope so hard that Miller

I hope so hard that Miller goes to the NFL.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:53 AM
(Reply to #16) #351
Tuebor
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If Miller leaves it hastens

If Miller leaves it hastens Meyer's departure from OSU

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:56 AM
(Reply to #22) #352
GoWings2008
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Respectfully disagree

He had a good time watching Guiton fill Braxton's shoes.  I think you're experiencing a little wishful thinking.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:59 AM
(Reply to #28) #353
Tuebor
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Guiton has no eligibility

Guiton has no eligibility left after this season.  If anyone it would be Cardale Jones filling Braxton's shoes and I am afraid of him because he don't go to OSU to play school.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:06 AM
(Reply to #33) #354
GoWings2008
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Ahh, yes...

my bad.  But I still think its some wishful thinking, until we hear something official, that he's going to the NFL.  I'm betting Urbz says he's not ready, even if he's ready...ifyouknowwhatimsayin.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:57 AM
(Reply to #22) #355
Don
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If Miller leaves it hastens Meyer's departure from OSU

I recommend putting all your life savings on that proposition in Vegas. It's a sure winner.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:00 AM
(Reply to #16) #356
Perkis-Size Me
Joined: 11/30/2011
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If he's smart he'll stay. If

If he's smart he'll stay. If Saturday proved anything it's that he's still an athlete playing QB. Going 6/15 passing doesn't scream NFL ready.



That being said, I hope he leaves too. That'd completely gut Meyer's offense for next year.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:32 PM
(Reply to #34) #357
woodfeld
Joined: 07/31/2008
MGoPoints: 790
Yes and no. Yes because he

Yes and no.

Yes because he clearly has room to improve to become a reliable NFL QB.

No because his stock won't be higher than this year given he loses 4 OL and Hyde and every defense will key on him now.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:48 AM
#358
Brightside
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Ohio loses all 5 starters on the line!

They will be beatable, as will all of the others. We have the talent on both sides of the ball if we don't shoot ourselves or cramp up in our play calling.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:50 AM
(Reply to #17) #359
dnak438
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They lose four of five

One of their starting tackles is a sophomore: http://ohiostate.rivals.com/cdepthtext.asp

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December 3rd, 2013 at 6:06 PM
(Reply to #18) #360
B1G_Fan
Joined: 10/11/2012
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Their offensive line next

Their offensive line next year should look alot like michigans this year.  The last two years they haven't pulled a ton of o linemen and there is a big possibility they could be starting redshirt freshman, walkons and true freshman.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:51 AM
#361
maize-blue
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I think Notre Dame could be a

I think Notre Dame could be a loss but I think we get W's against Ohio and Sparty. So maybe a 4-1 or 3-2 road record. I think this team will be improved next year and if they can generate any kind of running game with the RB whatsoever they will be in good shape. I think they will be pretty determined next year and on a mission to wipe this season away.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:52 AM
#362
unWavering
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I feel pretty good

About the ND game. In recent years it hasn't seemed like an overly tough road environment. In 2010 we pulled out the win and should have won in 2012. Not sure about who they lose/return, but my impression is that it will be your standard 8-4/9-3 type ND squad.

It remains to be seen how well MSU can recover drom losing almost everyone on D. If Narduzzi leaves it will put another huge dent in that D. I think we can pull out the win if our offense finds some identity (maybe a big if).

NW and Rutgers are gimmes. OSU will be undoubtedly tough but they will probably regress a little after losing their entire offensive line (after all, tjat happens to everyone, not just us, right? Right??) Either way it will be a close game.

I'm thinking 3-2 or 4-1 if things roll our way.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:05 AM
(Reply to #21) #363
Tuebor
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MSU does lose a bunch of

MSU does lose a bunch of talent on D but if they keep replacing Vernon Gholston's with Shillique Calhoun's their defense will still be top 15 in the country. 

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:19 AM
(Reply to #41) #364
1 percent
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Did you mean Tom?

Did you mean Tom?

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:53 AM
(Reply to #63) #365
Tuebor
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Thank you for the correction

Thank you for the correction I did mean Will Gholston.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:22 AM
(Reply to #41) #366
flashOverride
Joined: 08/04/2013
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*Will Gholston, you mean.

*Will Gholston, you mean. Vernon played for Ohio State. 

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:05 AM
(Reply to #21) #367
maize-blue
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Yup, MSU will lose 6 starting

Yup, MSU will lose 6 starting seniors next year on Defense and 3 of the 4 starting seniors on offense are O lineman. I don't see them matching this year's record.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:28 AM
(Reply to #42) #368
MGoRob
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Plus they now have to play

Plus they now have to play OSU in the regular season. Win-win situation for us finally

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:28 AM
(Reply to #21) #369
1 percent
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OSU

They lose their entire oline essentially their starting and back up RB and their backup QB. It wouldn't surprise me if Braxton saw that plus losing two and possibly D Smith to the L and bolted to the L himself.



They lose some other pretty good pieces on defense Roby, Barnett, C Bryant. I'm not sure about the Dline or LB corp but the dline should still be good with Spence, Bosa, Washington but hopefully Shazier bolts too.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:54 AM
#370
GoWings2008
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ND

Seems like the Irish suffered a similar season we did this year and will be hoping a reset on their season will help out, as we all do about Michigan.  The only advantage I see them having right now is home field, which is strong in that stadium but not insurmountable.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:34 AM
(Reply to #24) #371
Blue Mike
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What I find funny is that we

What I find funny is that we are apparently all afraid of playing in South Bend, but if you ever watch even 2 minutes of an ND game on NBC, all they talk about is how ND plays better on the road and isn't a good home team.  I understand that we can be nervous based on history there, but South Bend isn't the same place it used to be.  I think we go in there and win next year, with Devin having a big game in doing so.  

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:55 AM
#372
Don
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Under Hoke we have yet to beat a team in its own stadium

that's finished with a winning record during the regular season. The only road games we've won in the regular season are against teams with 6-6 records or worse.

One of the hallmarks of conference champions is that they go into the stadiums of good opponents and beat them.

Unless and until Hoke and his staff demonstrate that they can manage to lead Michigan to victory on the road against a good team during the regular season, we will not be anything more than mediocre.

 

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:07 AM
(Reply to #26) #373
Tuebor
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Agreed.  And until we go into

Agreed.  And until we go into a good teams house and bring back a win I can't in good conscience predict victories against ND, MSU, and OSU for next season.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 10:56 AM
#374
JohnCorbin
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Linebacking Corps

If everyone is healthy:
WLB: JR James Ross starting, SO Gideon will be a viable backup.
Mike: SR Morgan starting, Bolden backing up.
SLB: SR Ryan back to full form, with hopefully some able body to back him up.

I think our linebackers next year will be able to stop Miller when they need to.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:01 AM
(Reply to #27) #375
Magnus
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I'm wondering if Beyer will

I'm wondering if Beyer will stick at SAM linebacker so they can have Ryan, Beyer, and Clark on the field at the same time. Beyer seems too far away from SDE size to play there full-time next year, and using him as Clark's backup seems questionable because of Charlton and Ojemudia.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:09 AM
(Reply to #36) #376
Double Nickel BG
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Joined: 02/04/2009
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Didn't Roh

Jump from Beyerish size to 280-290ish his senior year ? I think Clark-Henry-Pipkins/Hurst- Beyer with Poggi/Stobel/Heitzman backing up puts your best front 4 on the field. Should be strong with Ross-Morgan-Ryan with Gedeon and Bolden backing up.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:10 AM
(Reply to #47) #377
Double Nickel BG
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Joined: 02/04/2009
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And

Ojemudia n Taco spelling Clark.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:12 AM
(Reply to #47) #378
Magnus
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Roh was 269 as a junior WDE.

Roh was 269 as a junior WDE. Then 281 as a senior SDE.

Beyer is 250 as a junior.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:18 AM
(Reply to #51) #379
Tuebor
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Yea.  The kid just doesn't

Yea.  The kid just doesn't have the frame to put much more weight on without losing athletic ability.  I say keep him at 250 and let him work in at WDE/SAM and SDE in nickel/passing situations.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:02 PM
(Reply to #47) #380
WolvinLA2
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Wormley?

Wormley?

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:48 PM
(Reply to #106) #381
Double Nickel BG
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Yup

Yup

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:04 AM
#382
TheWretchedBlunder
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Joined: 04/30/2013
MGoPoints: 300
yeah but

my cats announced this morning that UM's 2019 season will be undefeated. Write it down.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:07 AM
#383
Magnus
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Joined: 07/17/2008
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Those three losses that so

Those three losses that so many people are chalking up are toss-ups, in my opinion. Notre Dame has not been particularly impressive this year (8-4, just one blowout win against Air Force), I'm hoping Narduzzi gets a head coaching job this year and the defense falls off, and Ohio State is in line for a drop-off offensively with Hyde gone and Miller possibly leaving.

I'm not saying we'll go 5-0 in those games, but 2-3 is kind of pessimistic.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:27 AM
(Reply to #44) #384
Don
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Joined: 06/30/2008
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but 2-3 is kind of pessimistic.

I think that depends on one's view of how good our staff is. Or to put it another way, it depends on whether one thinks that our struggles this year are wholly and entirely attributable to youth/inexperience/lack of real talent, or whether coaching ability has played any role.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:44 AM
(Reply to #72) #385
dotslashderek
Joined: 01/10/2013
MGoPoints: 20
Maybe they're related

Could be the case that the coaches are specifically not great at coaching young players up *quickly*.  Could even be a deliberate decision to not apply bandaid short-term fixes that would result in bad fundamentals, and instead focus on getting the correct fundamentals ingrained (which is almost by definition not a short-term process).

Sorry, but the whole 1-4/2-3 stuff, the unrelenting negativity - it's just too much.  OK, back to lurking!

Cheers.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:40 AM
(Reply to #81) #386
Magnus
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I don't think it's all that

I don't think it's all that surprising that young teams are prone to losing on the road against good teams.

Next year the youth excuse disappears, in my opinion, with the exception of the offensive line (and running backs but that doesn't really matter much).

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:56 AM
(Reply to #89) #387
Tuebor
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But this year wasn't the

But this year wasn't the excuse the youth of the OL?  So saying next year the OL will still be young means we didn't make any progress in 2 seasons.  Plus come 2015 when we get a favorable home schedule we will be breaking in a new QB either Shane Morris or Wilton Speight.  2014 is a make or break season for Hoke and Co. and I have no faith in them to win road games against teams I expect to go bowling.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:06 PM
(Reply to #105) #388
Magnus
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We were young in some areas,

We were young in some areas, but we also lacked talent because of the Rich Rodriguez years. 2014 is when age/talent start to mesh. I'm not going to go position by position for three years and point out our deficiencies, but I will say that those deficiencies are starting to disappear.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:37 PM
(Reply to #109) #389
WolvinLA2
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In every year oh the Hoke

In every year oh the Hoke era, there has been a pretty large weak spot in almost every position group, sometimes due to injury (and thus lack of depth) and sometimes due to us not having the guys for that spot yet.  

This season, we had 2 non-frosh RBs we could rely on, and one tore his ACL in the opener.  The other, Fitz, just never got it back.  The frosh RBs have been coming on though, and they'll be the guys next year.  

On the OL, we have 3 new starters, who have been different guys seemingly every week, and of the ones who have seen the field regularly, they are RS Soph, RS Fr, RS Fr and true Fr.  Next year we should only have one OL with no starting experience and only one who isn't at least in his 3rd year (and those two aren't the same guy).  

We lose Gallon at WR, but holy smokes will we have a lot of talented bodies in the WR corps. Not to mention another year of maturation for guys like Butt and Funchess, who would be a nasty duo next year.  

Gardner had plenty of his own weaknesses this year, but those started to fade as the season went (November was our toughest schedule and Gardner had his fewest mistakes).  I don't expect him to be mistake-free as a 5th year senior but CW suggests those should keep decreasing.  

That's just the offense.  Defense actually looks brighter.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:36 AM
(Reply to #44) #390
aiglick
Joined: 11/27/2010
MGoPoints: 7860
This is an issue right here.

This is an issue right here. Our fan base wants teams that we play to get weaker rather than for our team to get stronger. I hope MSU keeps Narduzzi so we can finally beat him because our team improves and reaches their level. Ohio State has had some pretty good success the last decade+ but they've been a laughing stock nationally since they generally can't hang with elite teams from other conferences. This is probably the case because our conference is so weak right now that any damage a team does within it is next to nothing when compared to other teams' work with their hard schedules.

To be the best you've got to beat the best.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:38 AM
(Reply to #84) #391
GoWings2008
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Joined: 01/26/2011
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I like the way you think.

And especially with the conference/division shuffle coming, it seems to highlight that even more.

Well said.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:43 AM
(Reply to #84) #392
Magnus
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Joined: 07/17/2008
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The natural order of things

The natural order of things is that coordinators do well and move on to head coaching jobs, and position coaches move on to become coordinators (or head coaches).

I do want Michigan to improve, and I expect they will. I've been targeting 2014 for a couple years now. But I'm also not hoping for a team of all-time Buckeyes to regain eligibility and have to face a 'roided up David Boston, Orlando Pace, Eddie George, Joey Galloway, Andy Katzenmoyer, Vernon Gholston, etc.Good players graduate, and good coaches matriculate. That's the way it goes.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:45 AM
(Reply to #84) #393
Tuebor
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Joined: 03/14/2011
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Refreshing viewpoint. 

Refreshing viewpoint.  Starting next season we will have to beat the best with OSU, MSU, and PSU in our division playing the winner of Nebraska, Wisconsin in Indy.  Not an easy road the conference championship.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:07 AM
#394
I Hate Buckeyes
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Joined: 07/01/2013
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undefeated next year... my

undefeated next year... my mindset.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:10 AM
#395
flashOverride
Joined: 08/04/2013
MGoPoints: 6321
Jeez, I can't believe people

Jeez, I can't believe people are writing off these games as automatic losses. The season is nine months away. On multiple threads lately I've been seeing this. Michigan replacing two o-linemen next year will be a disaster, but MSU and OSU replacing three and four is but a speedbump for each of them? Come on now. I'm not necessarily saying Michigan is going to go into Columbus and East Lansing and just crack skulls, but I do sincerely believe that, personnel-wise, the two-deep is oh-so-close to that tipping point where what the coaches would like to do, and the tools to do it, finally meet. I think there needs to be at least a modicum of trust in people who are paid handsomely to evaluate progress (not just the coaches, but Brandon as well), to give them some benefit of the doubt that there is progress that simply isn't visible to us yet. At the very least I'm waiting until the bowl game before I start loading the lifeboats.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:29 AM
(Reply to #48) #396
Don
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Joined: 06/30/2008
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needs to be at least a modicum of trust in people who are paid

To paraphrase George H.W. Bush, "Trust, but verify."

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:48 AM
(Reply to #78) #397
flashOverride
Joined: 08/04/2013
MGoPoints: 6321
I'm fine with that mindset.

I'm fine with that mindset. And I'll happily admit I was wrong if Michigan gets thumped in these games, and that Hoke and staff probably aren't the crew to move this program forward. I just don't believe yet that they've had things the way they'd like them to be, in terms of personnel. I am willing to trust that they did consider the possibility of changing offensive philosophy this year to better match the players' skill sets, and concluded that it didn't guarantee success enough to justify injuring the development of their vision for the future. I know results have been ugly and I'm itching for that to change as much as anyone else. But I think we need to take into account the fact that Hoke didn't inherit anything like what Urban did, personnel-wise, and Dantonio has a four-year head start on him. It sucks in the interim, but I think next year is when we start to see results. And if I'm wrong, it won't be the first time, and I'll agree it's likely time to look in a new direction.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:10 AM
#398
g_reaper3
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Joined: 10/03/2010
MGoPoints: 2238
History would say 2-3

Given the schedule, that seems about right although I could see winning one of the tough 3.

On the flip side, we have a really good shot at winning all of our home games next year.  But I see a 9-3 season for 2014.

Then in 2015, we edge up to 10-2 (losing at Utah and PSU), but win the B1G East and the B1G.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:15 AM
#399
bubblelevel
Joined: 06/01/2011
MGoPoints: 361
What the F ?

Hey ! Let's get started being a downer and douche bag for next seasons projections too !  Hurray !

Really - your projections are based on your and the board's pitiful mob mentality this season.  Get over it.  You saw what the team can do Saturday.  Shit happens during seasons.  Borges is going to be OC'ing for his career and should be pretty close to what we saw Saturday.

Your analysis of teams is sophomoric.  

Worst case is at most 2 losses.  Realistic based on this team's roster and the opponents is 1 loss.

Braxton Miller sans Carlos Hyde is a loss next season if that's the case.  They guys on OSU behind Hyde are not in his category.  No Hyde Saturday and we would have won by 2 touchdowns.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:18 AM
(Reply to #55) #400
GoWings2008
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Joined: 01/26/2011
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So...

Sophomoric...is....bad, right?

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:39 AM
(Reply to #55) #401
Tuebor
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Joined: 03/14/2011
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Out of curiosity what was

Out of curiosity what was your worst case scenario for this year's team?

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:15 AM
#402
mGrowOld
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2-3.  There is nothing yet in

2-3.  There is nothing yet in Hoke's resume at Michigan that should give us any sense of false security that we're going to turn things around and start winning road games against quality opponents. We have yet to win even one road game against a team with a better than 500 record.

Until I see it happen once I'm betting against it happening.  

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:16 AM
#403
O Fo Sho
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Joined: 11/21/2011
MGoPoints: 429
STATE could-

fall off of a cliff next year.  They con't have the recruiting to remain consistant.  They are likely losing 7 from their defense and more importantly Narduzzi (hopefully).  State could easily be a 6-6 team next year. 

If our OL gels (i know, I know) we could be looking at a season like State is having this year.  We need to start winning on the road....i think that happens with maturity and we will start to see that next year.  ALSO- we just seem to have ND's number lately.  Devin will go for 450 yds on them and our D is going to make a mightly leap forward next year. 

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:23 AM
(Reply to #58) #404
Tuebor
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I don't buy the recruiting

I don't buy the recruiting argument.  Dantonio and Nardawg keep turning 3* recruits into all Big Ten defensive players even though we have been killing them on the recruiting trails.   

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:29 AM
(Reply to #58) #405
Ty Butterfield
Joined: 09/07/2009
MGoPoints: -84417
MSU has out coached Hoke and

MSU has out coached Hoke and Co in every game so far. It took a favorable spot on 4th down and a great catch by Dileo to win last year. Michigan has not scored a TD against MSU in 2 years. Sorry but I don't see Staee falling off a cliff.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 2:31 PM
(Reply to #79) #406
O Fo Sho
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Joined: 11/21/2011
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You Seem to Forget Quickly-

where was State just last year??  State is GREAT defensively this year, no question.  However, their recruiting doens't and won't allow them to be consistantly good.  They are losing 7 starters, most of all will be NFL players.  They are losing their defensive guru.  They most certainly will take a step back. 

You comment like they've been getting double digit W's every year.  They were average a year ago and lose a ton.  They have done a great job coaching up players. 

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December 3rd, 2013 at 3:39 PM
(Reply to #137) #407
Ty Butterfield
Joined: 09/07/2009
MGoPoints: -84417
Dantonio seems to be able to

Dantonio seems to be able to find the players he wants for his system. If the coaching staff at State can get them to perform well then star rankings do not matter. The suckitude of the RR years helped Dantonio immensely. Even last year when State went 7-6 Michigan could not score a TD. Sorry if I don't buy the "MSU is going away" argument.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:16 AM
#408
BlueUPer
Joined: 10/03/2010
MGoPoints: 2138
Sad to talk about next year already.

How can ND allow Everett Golson back into school?  Wow!  The Pope would bounce his ass off campus!

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:18 AM
#409
Reader71
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Joined: 08/30/2009
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I could see a loss @Rutgers.

I could see a loss @Rutgers. I am always weary of away games to stadiums no one on the team has ever seen before. This is why I thought we'd win our home game against Nebraska in 2011 and lose the road trip in 2012. I hope Rutgers is just really bad.

I don't think @NW is a real road game.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:21 AM
#410
Perkis-Size Me
Joined: 11/30/2011
MGoPoints: 40750
At this point, with this

At this point, with this coaching staff, every road game is a tossup, from OSU to Purdue. Our road performances are so woeful that until proven otherwise, I have zero faith that this staff can win a road game against a good opponent.



Call me a pessimist, but given the results over the past three years, I also consider myself a realist.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:26 AM
(Reply to #64) #411
Tuebor
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That is how I fell.  Just a

That is how I fell.  Just a realist.  A win @ND and dominating @Rutgers could have me feeling better.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 2:37 PM
(Reply to #64) #412
Reader71
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Joined: 08/30/2009
MGoPoints: 22152
The term "toss up" refers to

The term "toss up" refers to a coin toss, in which the odds are 50-50 heads-tails.

I think you mean that the winnable games are toss ups at best and the tougher games are losses.

I disagree.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:23 AM
#413
Schmoe
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Joined: 10/06/2008
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Oh-fer

Oh-fer

 

Okay maybe over Rutgers.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:43 AM
(Reply to #67) #414
swan flu
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Joined: 08/16/2010
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you must be really fun at

you must be really fun at parties...

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:28 AM
#415
Blueinsconsin
Joined: 08/24/2011
MGoPoints: 1106
OSU

also loses 4 starting OL and their D will be equal to what it is now if not worse. not sure what ND will have for returning starters on both sides of the ball

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:30 AM
#416
denardogasm
Joined: 09/11/2011
MGoPoints: 7964
Not sure why we'd be worried

Not sure why we'd be worried about Gholson. He was never that amazing and now hasn't played for a year and we get him early. My feelings on Sparty depend on Narduzzi's status. Northwestern is what they are and have ways been. Miller didn't beat us this year, Hyde did, and I hope the loss of him will be more of a loss than the gain of home field advantage. These are my thoughts but after this year I offer no predictions.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:33 AM
#417
Trebor
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Joined: 06/30/2008
MGoPoints: 3711
ND - Going out on a limb and

ND - Going out on a limb and saying we win. Golson is back, but he wasn't great by any stretch last year, so I'm not convinced he's the solution. Plus they lose Tuitt and Nix with no apparent replacement.

Rutgers - This should be a win. They were a mediocre AAC team, so they should be a mediocre-at-best B1G team.

MSU - Sadly, we contine this awful stretch of losing. It's no longer a "let's spend 364 days gameplanning for this," it's just a team with a great defense and generally effective-enough offense. As long as Dantonio is there, winning in East Lansing isn't going to be easy.

Northwestern - Win. No more Kain Colter, and Siemian isn't the Unstoppable Throw God he was last year. Venric Mark returning is scary, but without a truly mobile QB he's not the same threat from the RB spot.

OSU - Loss. No more Hyde, but they're not exactly hurting for offensive playmakers, as it would be incredibly surprising to see Miller go to the NFL when he doesn't have a viable position. 11 games to get a new OL to gel, plus returning all that DL talent, and it's going to be tough to win in Columbus.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:03 PM
(Reply to #90) #418
Ty Butterfield
Joined: 09/07/2009
MGoPoints: -84417
This sums things up

This sums things up perfectly. The time for excuses is over.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:37 PM
(Reply to #90) #419
bklein09
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Joined: 08/24/2009
MGoPoints: 7209
Win them all? If that's your

Win them all? If that's your expectation, then prepare for disappointment.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 1:11 PM
(Reply to #126) #420
Ty Butterfield
Joined: 09/07/2009
MGoPoints: -84417
Then after 2014 it will be

Then after 2014 it will be "this is Shane's first year starting, just wait until next year" etc.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:57 AM
#421
Lucky Socks
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Joined: 01/18/2012
MGoPoints: 2653
Me

@ND - I think their defense will take a step back. I don't think Gholston is a game changer, and I think our defense takes a big step forward. It'll be a challenge. But I think we win



@RU - Win

@NW - Win

@MSU - Their defense also loses a ton. Their offense might take a step forward, but I don't think they'll ever be anything much more than effective and efficient (i.e not scary, explosive). Win, we need it.

@OSU - I think they'll be better. But I also believe we'll be much better. I think we'll be good enough to beat a great team on the road. Loss, but it's a push.



I have a reputation for being an optimist. I think our program takes a permanent step forward next year. 10 wins, even with the schedule. At least 2-1 versus rivals. And don't underestimate a team that has been beaten up verbally and physically as underclassmen. Just like 2011, I think we'll have a chip on our shoulder - except we'll also be a better team across the board.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 11:59 AM
#422
TorontoBlue
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Joined: 06/30/2008
MGoPoints: 775
road trip

My son and I have met in AA for a football weekend every season since 2002.  With the crappy home slate for 2014, we are thinking its time for a road trip to an away game.  Targeting ND for  the series finale or the first-ever visit to Rutgers.  Thoughts, anyone?

GO BLUE!

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:09 PM
(Reply to #103) #423
Tuebor
Tuebor's picture
Joined: 03/14/2011
MGoPoints: 15354
The crappy home slate is why

The crappy home slate is why I'm not getting season tickets this year.  It will be cheaper to just buy PSU night game tickets on stubhub.  The rest of the games will be going for below face value in the secondary markets. 

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:19 PM
#424
xxxxNateDaGreat
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Joined: 11/28/2011
MGoPoints: 2930
I predict Michigan wins some

I predict Michigan wins some road games, loses others.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:21 PM
#425
bo_lives
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Joined: 04/10/2011
MGoPoints: 4290
well you guys are an optimistic bunch

No one is concerned that Hoke has not won a game on the road against a team that finished above .500, in THREE years?

We'll be on the road against our two Rivals who combined have one loss in 2013. MSU has eaten Borges's lunch three years straight and OSU may still be undefeated under Meyer and the reigning national champs...

Not trying to be a negative Nancy, but when your OC has had like, 10 games under 300 yards and like, 5 games without TDs... and the head coach is HAPPY with the job the guy is doing... well, what can you expect really.

My prediction is that the line still sucks, and Space Coyote will have to explain to everyone how you have to wait for that magical year when all 5 of your offensive linemen are 5* RS Seniors with three years starting experience in order to average above 3 yards/attempt. It would not shock me if we lost all of our road games, though I will probably still go to at least 3 of them.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:26 PM
#426
WolverineInCbus
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Joined: 11/26/2012
MGoPoints: 3478
Notre dame

I'm not worried about Golson personally. I don't really think he is that good to be honest. I think we beat notre dame

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:30 PM
#427
Michigan Arrogance
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Joined: 06/30/2008
MGoPoints: 15317
at this point, i'd be much

at this point, i'd be much more concerned about the Minn game at home than @NW

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:32 PM
#428
FlexUM
Joined: 11/05/2011
MGoPoints: 531
If they lose 3 out of 5 of

If they lose 3 out of 5 of those there should be wholesale changes to the staff and a complete re-evalatuion of the direction of the program.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:54 PM
(Reply to #120) #429
The Dirty Nil
Joined: 05/13/2012
MGoPoints: 5703
Spot on.

Spot on.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:59 PM
(Reply to #120) #430
Magnus
Magnus's picture
Joined: 07/17/2008
MGoPoints: 123040
If Michigan goes 9-3 next

If Michigan goes 9-3 next year and beats Ohio State and Michigan State, I think I would be okay with that.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 1:08 PM
(Reply to #129) #431
Tuebor
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Joined: 03/14/2011
MGoPoints: 15354
That would mean you predict

That would mean you predict us to go 7-0 at home no? I see 2 sure Wins and 5 games that this year makes me questionable on. 

App State - Win, no doubt about it

Miami (OH) - Win, See above

Utah - 33 in sagarin ratings with a 5-7 record in the Pac12,

Minnesota - No longer a guaranteed win.

Penn State - Will the sanction bomb ever hit?

Indiana - If they find even a slightly below average defense look out

Maryland - 7-5 in the ACC.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 2:13 PM
(Reply to #130) #432
Magnus
Magnus's picture
Joined: 07/17/2008
MGoPoints: 123040
I'm not predicting anything.

I'm not predicting anything. I'm saying I would be satisfied with 9-3 and wins against OSU and MSU.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 2:55 PM
(Reply to #130) #433
Blue Mike
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Joined: 12/12/2012
MGoPoints: 2338
Wait, why are we so concerned

Wait, why are we so concerned with Minnesota?  Is this what our pessimism and negativity has come to?  People do remember that we handled them pretty easily this year, at home, right?  Other than the one march down the field, we kept them in check pretty well.  They went on a run after that against the weakest part of the schedule, but let's not make them out to be a 10-win team or anything.

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:35 PM
#434
LSAClassOf2000
LSAClassOf2000's picture
Joined: 01/07/2011
MGoPoints: 81381
No Definite Conclusions...

Well, if you used the Sagarin numbers right now to predict 2014 - which is a not the best thing to do because of the lack of 2014 data, so take the conclusion for what it is worth - we could likely be 2-3. We would be favored against Rutgers and Northwestern, a slight underdog against ND and a sizeable underdog against MSU and Ohio State. Again, that's based on present data, which may or may not mean as much in 2014. There's still much we don't know. 

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December 3rd, 2013 at 12:43 PM
(Reply to #121) #435
WolvinLA2
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Joined: 11/13/2009
MGoPoints: 52761
Yeah, not a bad exercise but

Yeah, not a bad exercise but not particularly telling either.  All teams lose players, and it's still unknown how many that will be, though it's possible (if not likely) that all three lose more talent than we do.   Especially in the case of OSU and ND, where their QB situation for 2014 is up in the air.  

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