18 Years Since a Big 10 QB Has Been Drafted in the 1st Round
As I've been perusing the weekly NFL/NCAA articles on the wonder that is "MSU QB U" (Hoyer, Stanton, Cousins) [barf] and why the Big 10 is complete garbage I came upon a startling stat - the Big 10 has not had a 1st round draft pick at QB since 1995 - Kerry Collins. I've cited the lack of elite QB talent in the conference a few times the past few years but growing up in an era where the average to decent Big 10 teams threw out Chuck Longs and Jeff Georges (say what you will about their NFL careers but these guys were gunslingers in college and drafted very early), that data point was a pretty damn sharp slap to the face.
Yes draft position doesn't mean the end all be all about success in the NFL, but consider QBs generally get drafted much higher than they should be on talent alone due to this being the most important position in the sport. So it's pretty damning. Lately, it seems the SEC, Pac12, and Big 12 are QB central.
Drew Stanton, Drew Brees (2001) and our own Chad Henne came the closest to breaking that streak as 2nd round draft choices. Some have Conner Cook mocked as a late 1st rounder so if not him than Hackenberg should break the streak soon but elite QB play has certainly not been a hallmark of Big 10 football for the past 15 years outside of Drew Brees, a few of our guys and MSU's guys. Tressel-ball never really required it; neither did Alvarez-ball. PSU has not been good at developing QBs the past decade. We've obviously gone a different way since 2008. And before we blame the spread - "the spread has taken over the Big 10!" - the same systems have spread all over the NCAA.
Went back to look from 2004 (10 years) and here is the list and round of NFL QBs - Russell Wilson could barely be called a Big 10 QB as most of his career was NC State. The last 2 years there has not been a single Big 10 QB drafted in ANY round.
- 2004 - Krenzel (5th) OSU, Sorgi (6th) Wisconsin, Smoker (6th) MSU, Navarre (7th) UM
- 2005 - Orton (4th) Purdue
- 2006 - shutout
- 2007 - Stanton (2nd) MSU, Smith (5th) OSU
- 2008 - Henne (2nd) UM
- 2009 - Painter (6th) Purdue
- 2010 - Kafka (4th) Northwestern
- 2011 - Stanzi (5th) Iowa
- 2012 - Wilson** (3rd) Wisconsin, Cousin (4th) MSU
- 2013 - shutout
- 2014 - shutout
-->Terrelle Pryor was a 3rd round supplemental pick.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:01 PM ^
and yet 3 different Michigan St QB's alone lead their teams to wins this past weekend
September 19th, 2014 at 9:10 PM ^
Stanton threw for 167 yards and 0 TDs, and Hoyer threw for 204 yards and 1 TD. That's not what I would call "leading" your team to a win.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:15 PM ^
nitpickers gonna nitpick
September 19th, 2014 at 9:23 PM ^
Hey, I didn't get a reputation for being petty, obnoxious, and argumentative by leaving nits alone.
September 20th, 2014 at 10:33 AM ^
Never let it be forgotten that Tom Brady threw for 140 yards in his first Super Bowl.
Different era, yes I know.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:58 PM ^
Great point! What you're saying is... basically... that... what exactly is your point?
September 19th, 2014 at 9:03 PM ^
Krenzel went to my high school's rival.
I remember in my senior year, making the road trip for the basketball game to their gym and they had a display for him in their gym.
His jersey and "BUCKEYE ALL-AMERICAN" in big letters. Lame.
Good thing my HS took their team down rather easily. Same for football, all 4 years.
/coolstorybro
September 19th, 2014 at 9:13 PM ^
Sorgi is from Fraser, MI and had potentially the best career of anyone over the past 15 years - backed up Peyton Manning for almost decade, threw maybe 100 passes? (if that?) in that decade, and collect paycheck weekly. Rinse, wash, repeat.
Charlie Batch from EMU - once he left Detroit to go to the Steelers had basically the same role although I can remember him actually playing 5-6 games since he went to Pittsburgh.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:22 PM ^
We have a Fraser alum on this board. I'm not gonna say who in case he doesn't want me to for privacy, but small world. That's not that far away from me at all.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:48 PM ^
Go Ramblers.
September 19th, 2014 at 10:14 PM ^
Sent from MGoBlog HD for iPhone & iPad
September 19th, 2014 at 10:17 PM ^
I was talking about you since you follow me on twitter and I saw it in your bio.
The college you go to is in the city that borders mine.
September 19th, 2014 at 11:24 PM ^
back in the mid-late 90's. Just didn't have the bodies to compete in football.
September 19th, 2014 at 10:40 PM ^
Krenzel went to Ford II. Which means you must have went to Utica.
#TheRealMACTION
September 19th, 2014 at 10:55 PM ^
Yeah. We rushed Ford's field my senior year. We also rushed Warren Cousino's.
I heard that they now keep security by the gates on the opponent sidelines for games in Macomb County now. I like to believe that the class of 2014 was the reason for that.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:14 PM ^
The B1G has, at worst, the second best group of starting qbs in the league. Obviously I'd vote them first (I really don't like Eli). No, the PAC doesn't have a dog in this race.
You know where Brady was drafted. Also know that Brees wasn't in the first round. Wilson was third round.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:18 PM ^
Why care?
Because high potential NFL type QBs can put a team on their back at the NCAA level. They help you win a lot of games. They bring success to a program. Chuck Long led some of Hayden Fry's best Iowa teams and Jeff George made Illinois successful. Yes Illinois! Brees made an otherwise average Purdue dangerous. Wilson for his 1 year made Wisconsin 2 dimensional rather than "dude who hands off to Wisconsin RBs 40x a game" QBs they usually roll out.
Yes you can win without a great QB if you have an elite defense (97 UM, 02 OSU) but it sure helps having a guy who impacts every offensive play. The Big 10 is partly a piece of crap because its level of QB play has increasingly sucked in a general sense. Among other reasons.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:23 PM ^
It's about the fact that the B1G has virtually indisputably produced more [current] quality QBs than any other conference. You can argue for the SEC. That's about it.
The fact that these QBs weren't drafted in the first round doesn't mean much considering their success.
If anything it's a black spot on the people in charge of drafting.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:29 PM ^
Thats not the point either. Brady blossomed in the NFL after being a "decent college QB" - and that was over a decade ago. Brees was also over a decade ago.
Brees and Henne I'd argue were the 2 best QBs at the college level of the past decade+. Did I miss a slew of QBs that ripped up the NCAA that the NFL missed on. That's 3 QBs... maybe throw in Cousins as a solid pro style QB at the NCAA level.
Of course you can win in other ways (Tebow, Pryor) at the NCAA level.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:34 PM ^
Unless you consider him ACC.
Qbs in the NFL is one of the few (very few) areas that you can't really rip the B1G for (not that I think you're trying, man).
Compare who the B1G has in the NFL (starting) versus the PAC (B1G wins), SEC (meh, I can see the argument), B12 (B1G wins), everyone else: (B1G wins).
You're using a statistic (first round qb drafted) that, ultimately, doesn't matter at all. Not only that, but it's been proven (by B1G qbs) to be a bad stat.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:44 PM ^
The PAC only has five starters to the B1G's six but the quality's high: Rodgers, Luck, Foles, Locker. Smith's not bad if you grandfather Utah in, backwards. To be honest, I like that list better than the SEC's.
Your point stands, though. The B1G has the longest list and it's been as good as anybody's at the top.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:49 PM ^
Wilson had 1 year at Wisconsin as a transfer. Saying he is a Big 10 QB is saying Nick Foles is a Big 10 QB.
And again I am not arguing NFL production.
The question is why is the Big 10 down? Having top end NCAA QBs WHILE in college would help to fix the conferences issues. So our control group over the past decade is guys like Stanton Henne Cousins Stanzis Ortons Troy Smiths Pryors etc. And how they are doing with their NCAA teams - thus helping the Big 10 not look like sh$$ every week.
Brees was a massive talent at Purdue comparable to a guy like a Luck or Leinhart AT THE COLLEGE LEVEL hence HELPING his team be an actual decent team (Purdue). Versus the horror show it is now.
Vince Young may have been the best QB in the past 10 years on that assessment - he helped bring a national title to an otherwise good but not great Texas program. On that count he was a massive success - even if he was a disaster in the NFL. So he was drafted high on that production (and potential) as was Brees.
The Big 10 hasnt had a ton of those types of dudes (Henne, Cousins) the past 10 years while some other conferences have had much more. Why? How can we change it? Does it matter? Maybe it doesnt matter - maybe we can roll around with non NFL quality QBs by and large and have success. But it hasnt worked that well the last decade.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:57 PM ^
The problem he had with his previous staff, in my opinion, is enough to make him a B1G player.
But not for stat arguments like this, so I understand.
Why? How can we change it? Does it matter? Maybe it doesnt matter - maybe we can roll around with non NFL quality QBs by and large and have success. But it hasnt worked that well the last decade.
It doesn't matter. In my opinion, at least. And frankly, the B1G has been pulling in and will continue to pull in, qb talent. If I had to name any position group that the B1G lacked in, it's speed on the defensive line. How you solve something like that? No idea. That's just my take.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:36 PM ^
I think you are arguing NFL production...which doesnt help NCAA teams unless they replicate at the NCAA level. SEC only? Pac 12 has destroyed the Big 10 the past decade in productive NCAA QBs. Big 12 is competitive .... only ACC is on Big 10 level.
Pac 12 last decade - Andrew Luck, Sanchez, Leinhart, Rodgers, (Andrew) Walter, Kellen Clemons, Trent Edwards, Dennis Dixon, Jake Locker, Nick Foles
Big 12 last decade - Bradford, Vince Young, McCoy, Josh Freeman, Weeden
ACC last decade - Rivers, Schaub, Whitehurst, Christian Ponder
Again I am speaking to the NCAA production that helps NCAA teams win - not what scouts missed or which guys flamed out in the NFL. The Big 10 needs to produce guys to help them ...in the NCAA.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:44 PM ^
(and feel free to call me a moron afterwards for not seeing it originally):
The B1G has not had a qb that has passed for enough yards with enough accurracy while playing college ball in order to warrant a first round pick in a long while?
That's your point, correct?
I once again repeat: who cares? Bear in mind that I mean no disrespect to you personally, alum.
In fact, I think you get the better of it most times we talk.
But again, I repeat: who cares? The B1G has been dominating the qb scene for quite some time.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:59 PM ^
The B1G has been dominating the qb scene for quite some time.
Ok we'll agree to disagree. You are pulling 2 great QBs from 12-15 years ago - one of which no one on earth expected to be the best QB in the NFL based on college production as a reason why the Big 10 shouldnt worry about its QB talent.
I think if you survey the NCAA over the past 10 years and said "which conference is producing QBs that are carrying their team at the college level" you'd get a different answer than "The Big 10 is second after the SEC" but that's my opinion and I respect that yours is different. Someone who is an afterhought now like a Dennis Dixon for 2 years at Oregon did more than all but perhaps 4 Big 10 QBs at the NCAA level the past decade. Thus helping Oregon much like a Henne helped Michigan or a Brees helped Purdue. And Dixon wouldnt be a guy you'd think of even as a top 5 QB the past decade for his conference.
September 19th, 2014 at 10:12 PM ^
I think if you survey the NCAA over the past 10 years and said "which conference is producting QBs that are carrying their team at the college level" you'd get a different answer than "The Big 10 is second after the SEC" but that's my opinion and I respect that yours is different.
Cutler, Stafford and Newton then? Yeah, I'll go with the PAC.
Feel free to guess why you your point isn't really on point (it involves us having to talk about this again in a year or two).
Edit: well argued, alum (which doesn't mean I think you're right. It was just well argued. /cheers).
September 19th, 2014 at 10:16 PM ^
I was actually thinking as I was typing the response to you earlier how this conversation would go in 3-4 years. The OP would no longer be valid as at minimum Hackenberg will be drafted, breaking the streak at 20 years (if Cook doesnt break it first) but in a rolling 15 year time frame Brees and Brady would go away and we'd be replacing the with Cook and Hackenberg... then we could have the same conversation. So here is to hoping Hackenberg and Cook are 3 of the top 5 NFL QBs in 4 years ;)
I am curious on your age as well - to me Brees did for Purdue what a guy like Jeff George did for Illinois in the 80s. Took an ok team and made it top 4ish in the Big 10 almost single handidly as an elite QB. So when you say "why does it matter" - my only retort is a great QB can make a huge difference in making a college team much better. Take Hackenberg off PSU right now and put in Iowa's QB and they might win 4 games this year. Put Hackenberg on Iowa right now and with their ridiculous schedule they'd be favorites in the West.Havi
Havinng more Staffords, Manziels, Lucks, Bradfords , Leinharts, Tannehills in conference would help offset some of the obvious deficiencies this conference has at other positions.
September 19th, 2014 at 10:27 PM ^
Michigan fan since 2006 (first year there).
My answer of course is twofold, however, the B1G has not been producing first round qb picks like you stated.
It ridiculous to pretend that means anything because it's virtually impossible to pick the next Tom Brady.
At the same time, however, I realize that having a college qb that is pumping out stats is good for the college program.
My response, of course, is that the stats don't matter. It's about having a great qb. The B1G has consistently produced those.
The "first round" metric is silly.
Pretending that the first round selection is more important than what qbs have actually produced is more than silly.
18 Years Since a Big 10 QB Has Been Drafted in the 1st Round
September 20th, 2014 at 1:01 PM ^
September 20th, 2014 at 3:03 AM ^
only lasted about 10 years in the nfl. certainly not an elite college QB.
/s
September 19th, 2014 at 9:36 PM ^
September 19th, 2014 at 9:46 PM ^
are still starting? Hardly.
edit: now if we want to talk about how every quality qb comes from Texas... that might be a post.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:14 PM ^
September 19th, 2014 at 9:15 PM ^
Especially impressive considering the running game that PSU is spitting out.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:20 PM ^
Walter Football currently has him as the #1 overall for 2016. Hard to judge him this year since he is running for his life every play. (as an aside Cook is in their top 10 overall last I looked as well - after Winston and Mariotta).
September 19th, 2014 at 10:44 PM ^
September 19th, 2014 at 9:17 PM ^
September 19th, 2014 at 9:21 PM ^
A MSU v UM dick measuring contest wasnt the point of this post at all.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:18 PM ^
we have produced Brady and Brees, two of the top QBs
September 19th, 2014 at 9:18 PM ^
September 19th, 2014 at 9:23 PM ^
Brees was highly regarded; the only thing holding him back was his height out of college. He still was drafted at the front end of the 2nd round (almost a 1st) despite being 6'0 in a league that wants its QBs 6'3+. If he was 6'3 he would probably have been a top 5 pick with the only question being "was he a system QB?".
Brady obviously was a massive outlier - his college production vs NFL production is most likely the highest variance of any QB the past 20 years.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:29 PM ^
September 19th, 2014 at 9:33 PM ^
September 19th, 2014 at 9:37 PM ^
September 19th, 2014 at 9:38 PM ^
i seem to remember guys like pryor and denard getting drafted off the top of my head. i'm guessing i can probably find others too not on this list. i think the lions drafted a QB out of minny some years back too, iirc.
September 19th, 2014 at 10:03 PM ^
Pryor is listed in the OP as a 3rd rounder supplemental pick.
Denard is not a QB in the NFL so is not being listed as such. He wasn't drafted on his QB ability or else he'd be playing QB.
September 20th, 2014 at 2:46 AM ^
is pryor and denard were very successful college QBs. in recent years osu and um went to non-pro-style QBs; the two schools who recruit at the highest level in the BIG. hence, nfl draft #s decline as a result. even psu went the dual threat route for a few years.
to suggest the quality of play has declined in the BIG because of QB play is false, imo; this year excepted.
most top 10 schools would be happy with a player like denard, pryor or miller.
September 20th, 2014 at 10:16 AM ^
As I wrote in the OP I'd argue that is not a Big 10 thing. That is a NCAA thing. To argue aotherwise would say the Big 10 has gone to a conference of stretch type offenses while the rest of the NCAA stayed in pro style sets. Look at Florida - they did the same thing UM did; under Spurrier they had guys who were NFL draft picks in the pro style run and gun. Then Urban showed up and they went to a more college type system (although Tebow did get drafted high, he wasnt playing in a pro style set). So it is happening everywhere where other type of QBs are being utilized, not just the Big 10.
September 19th, 2014 at 9:42 PM ^
For help in supplementing this discussion, which I do find interesting, DraftHistory provides the QB-specific data here - LINK - by round, pick, overall position and then name and school. Here is the complete list of QBs that have gone in the first round since 2000:
| Round | Pick | Player | Name | Team | College |
| 1 | 1 | 1 | Cam Newton | Panthers | Auburn |
| 1 | 25 | 25 | Jason Campbell | Redskins | Auburn |
| 1 | 2 | 2 | Robert Griffin III | Redskins | Baylor |
| 1 | 3 | 3 | Matt Ryan | Falcons | Boston College |
| 1 | 24 | 24 | Aaron Rodgers | Packers | California |
| 1 | 19 | 19 | Kyle Boller | Ravens | California |
| 1 | 3 | 3 | Blake Bortles | Jaguars | Central Florida |
| 1 | 18 | 18 | Joe Flacco | Ravens | Delaware |
| 1 | 25 | 25 | Tim Tebow | Broncos | Florida |
| 1 | 22 | 22 | Rex Grossman | Bears | Florida |
| 1 | 16 | 16 | E.J. Manuel | Bills | Florida State |
| 1 | 12 | 12 | Christian Ponder | Vikings | Florida State |
| 1 | 1 | 1 | David Carr | Texans | Fresno State |
| 1 | 1 | 1 | Matthew Stafford | Lions | Georgia |
| 1 | 17 | 17 | Josh Freeman | Buccaneers | Kansas State |
| 1 | 1 | 1 | JaMarcus Russell | Raiders | Louisiana State |
| 1 | 32 | 32 | Teddy Bridgewater | Vikings | Louisville |
| 1 | 7 | 7 | Byron Leftwich | Jaguars | Marshall |
| 1 | 18 | 18 | Chad Pennington | Jets | Marshall |
| 1 | 11 | 11 | Ben Roethlisberger | Steelers | Miami (OH) |
| 1 | 1 | 1 | Eli Manning | Chargers | Mississippi |
| 1 | 10 | 10 | Blaine Gabbert | Jaguars | Missouri |
| 1 | 4 | 4 | Philip Rivers | Giants | North Carolina State |
| 1 | 22 | 22 | Brady Quinn | Browns | Notre Dame |
| 1 | 1 | 1 | Sam Bradford | Rams | Oklahoma |
| 1 | 22 | 22 | Brandon Weeden | Browns | Oklahoma State |
| 1 | 3 | 3 | Joey Harrington | Lions | Oregon |
| 1 | 1 | 1 | Andrew Luck | Colts | Stanford |
| 1 | 3 | 3 | Vince Young | Titans | Texas |
| 1 | 22 | 22 | Johnny Manziel | Browns | Texas A&M |
| 1 | 8 | 8 | Ryan Tannehill | Dolphins | Texas A&M |
| 1 | 22 | 22 | J.P. Losman | Bills | Tulane |
| 1 | 32 | 32 | Patrick Ramsey | Redskins | Tulane |
| 1 | 5 | 5 | Mark Sanchez | Jets | USC |
| 1 | 10 | 10 | Matt Leinart | Cardinals | USC |
| 1 | 1 | 1 | Carson Palmer | Bengals | USC |
| 1 | 1 | 1 | Alex Smith | 49ers | Utah |
| 1 | 11 | 11 | Jay Cutler | Broncos | Vanderbilt |
| 1 | 1 | 1 | Michael Vick | Falcons | Virginia Tech |
| 1 | 8 | 8 | Jake Locker | Titans | Washington |
The most prolific teams regardless of draft position in the same period would be USC, LSU, Georgia and Louisville.