Responding to the Letter in Michigan Alumnus

Submitted by MGoBender on

The following letter appears in the Fall issue of the Alumni Association Magazine.  I have wrote a letter in response.  I encourage you all to do the same and/or offer some feedback on my letter.  This dude graduated in '61 and is probably completely out of touch with reality, but I still want to slap him across the face.  And if the Alumni Association prints something like this, I think it says a lot about the pressure David Brandon will be faced with if this season does not go well. 

Let's Return to Athletic Tradition

I have been a long-time supporter of U-M athletics.  My dad was a track man, holding a Big Ten record for nine years.  My daughter was a swimmer and lettered for four years.  I went to school at U-M in the late '50s and graduated in 1961. 

Now please ask me how I can support our two major sports teams when our University has let things go so far away from any and every Michigan tradition.  I still have season tickets for football and basketball (sustaining member of the Victors Club), but sometimes I ask myself why.  I am not alone with this very negative attitude, and only the future will tell the University how its supporters are disgusted.  Just another example was that terrible defensive call for the last 2.2 seconds of the OSU game during the Big Ten Tournament.  The University, regents and president are not responsible caretakers of our athletic tradition.  Why Michigan fell in love with coaches from West Virginia, I have no idea, but they have put us back way before our glory days starting with 1969.  The entire thing makes me upset. 

The president is very kind to send us all a nice Christmas card every year, but I wish she could understand what is happening on State Street.  The only positive thing I can think of is our new athletic director, but it bothers me he seems to support these coaches and that one of them was on the president’s selection team for his new position.  I would assume his hands are tied for at least the next few years.  Maybe when Michigan gets NCAA sanctions in August, we will all really understand how far we have fallen.  Oh, but the football coach’s job is secure for yet another season.  I guess someone forgot the old and new investments that the University has on State and Stadium streets.

T.H. Smith, '61

Clarkson Michigan

 

My letter to the Michigan Alumnus:

 

Stick By Our Teams, Keep Believing

T.H. Smith (’61) wrote a letter that appeared in the Fall ’10 edition of the Michigan Alumnus.  Mr. Smith asked how he can support our two major sports teams.  To Mr. Smith and anyone else who may feel similarly, I would like to offer a response to that question.

Coach Beilein, in just his second season in Ann Arbor, took a squad to the second round of the tournament – the first time Michigan had even made the NCAA tournament in over a decade. Additionally, Coach Beilein is highly regarded throughout the collegiate basketball sphere and is the head of the NCAA Ethics Coalition, a major reason that President Coleman trusted him for insight on the search for a new athletic director.  Coach Beilein is a man of the utmost dignity and respect and deserves every Michigan fan and alum’s support.

Coach Rodriguez came into a difficult situation.  Our football team happened upon a severe lack of depth in talent on both sides of the football, forcing Coach Rodriguez to rebuild from the bottom.  He has come under fire for major violations even though they appear to be the result of a lack of institutional accountability in the athletic department.*   And, yes, on the field he may have underachieved in the first two years of his tenure.  However, he has said and done nothing but proudly represent the University of Michigan.  Most importantly, he is the coach of 105 student athletes that proudly play for Michigan, and that should be reason enough to earn your support.

Last year Michigan Athletics saw great accomplishments in volleyball, hockey, softball, women’s tennis, women’s gymnastics, and water polo in addition to a National Championship in men’s gymnastics.  All reasons to support the athletic program we love.

In closing, I leave you with this quote, and urge you to support our coaches and student-athletes in all sports:

“When your team is winning, be ready to be tough, because winning can make you soft; on the other hand, when your team is losing, stick by them.  Keep believing.” – Bo Schembechler

--------

EDIT: * Updated.  Previous sentence referenced the Lloyd Carr era b/c that was when Labadie and Draper were hired, but it came off as being accusing of Lloyd, which I did not intend.

Comments

ThatOneGuy

August 13th, 2010 at 2:13 PM ^

These (not yours) letters frustrated the hell out of me. Booing your team frustrates the hell out of me. Constant complaining about how bad the coaching is is pissing me off. Maybe it's just my Nebraska ways but all of those things I stated are incredibly low. You stick by your team thick and thin, through hard times and through the best of times. This lack of respect I've noticed is incredible.

w2j2

August 13th, 2010 at 2:16 PM ^

What does a particular play in a particular game have to do with UM athletic tradition? 

UM recruited the best coaches it could find.  What does West Virginia have to do with it?

Old man, you are upset that you cannot drink your warm milk and be happy about a winning team.  You know nothing about sports. 

Call your nurse and have her help you back to bed.

MGoBender

August 13th, 2010 at 2:21 PM ^

Yeah, I wanted to respond to each and every point, but my letter was getting long so I cut a lot out.

A single play as a reason to not support a team?  Come on.  I was as pissed as anyone at Beilein for that play, but Christ the better team won.  It was a disappointing year.  That won't stop me from supporting my classmates and Michigan's student athletes.

bouje

August 13th, 2010 at 2:23 PM ^

when at the ND game this guy started boo'ing RR.  We got into a verbal argument.  When we won the game he just gave me the look of "you were right I was wrong"  (although if he had saw me after the OSU game he might have seen that I was giving him the look of "TO BE CONTINUED"). 

 

For someone to say that JB has besmirched the Michigan name in basketball is..  (I'm just going to say it and I don't care how UN-PC it is) RE-TAR-DED.  Where the fuck has this guy been?  Has he been on Mars in a cave with his fingers in his ears going LALALALLALALALALALALALALA?  We've been bad at Basketball since the Fab 5 and JB brought us back (albeit for one year) and brought us back the right way. 

 

RR I can understand how people can be frustrated and for me this is the do or die year.  I personally believe that he should have another year because he walked into a shit-storm and no one could have coached us to a "respectable season record for the masses". 

 

In sum though: Great response, I hate old people.  I will never become them..  I will never become them...  I'll always be cool... 

Wolverine0056

August 13th, 2010 at 2:25 PM ^

Tom I applaud you and thank you for your letter. If I were an alum of UM I would also write a letter to a similar extent of yours. Thank you again sir, you are one of many reasons we believe in our team and university.

M-Wolverine

August 13th, 2010 at 2:26 PM ^

He inherited a compliance issue from the Lloyd Carr era that resulted in NCAA violations.
Because it's untrue. He inherited the paperwork problem that would have (maybe) caught the issue, but the issue was with his assistants. As the carryover from West Virginia (And WV's continuing to do it) showed. The way you worked it, you made it seem like there were violations, and they just continued into his term. The CARA forms aren't required. They're just a means to an end. That are used to find out if there are any problems. Which may not have been thought of as a problem anyway, because they obviously weren't thought of as one at WV. Because the rule is so vague. Unless they didn't file their paperwork either.

MGoBender

August 13th, 2010 at 2:41 PM ^

RR didn't bring really bring anything over, though, from my understanding.  Labadie and Draper were at Michigan prior to Rodriguez, correct?

Maybe this would be a better wording:

"Because of a lapse in institutional accountability by the athletic department, Coach Rodriguez unjustly became the face of the compliance issues that led to major violations."

M-Wolverine

August 13th, 2010 at 2:58 PM ^

Not filing the CARA paperwork is no violation. It's not even an NCAA requirement. It's just a means (chosen by the University, and I'm guessing, others) to track these issues. In some extent, not "overseeing" all this brings up institutional control issues, so in the macro it could be considered a violation, but not the micro. The violation was that the coaches Rich brought in were at places and observing things they weren't permitted to do. Mainly, I still content, because the rule isn't clear at all on what they ARE permitted to do.  Which is why he did it at WV, and brought it over with him, and didn't see any problem with it. The equivalent student assistants under Lloyd weren't named.  The guys you mention were Lloyd guys.  But they didn't commit the violations. They didn't do the follow-up (CARA forms, job descriptions) that MAY have allowed compliance to find out what they were doing, and if it was permitted.  Maybe.  Because, I assume they did have people filing similar paperwork at West Virginia, and their compliance dept. never saw anything wrong with it. Which means a few different things could have happened.  Our compliance is way smarter than theirs, says oh no, stop this. Our compliance sees things the same way as WV's, the rule is weird....they don't say anything to stop it.  Or WV's paperwork is as F'd up as ours, they never got notice (Even in the years after Rich left), and both screwed up, and could have told Rich to stop. The last is actually the most damning though, because if both are letting the paperwork slide, that seems like there would be some pressure coming from the coaching staff to let it slide. I find it much easier to believe the rules are just obtuse as all get out, one school didn't see it as a problem, the other never got the chance to review it because they didn't see it...and may or may not have seen it as a problem.

I mean the whole thing....there's tons of blame to go around, from Rich, his assistants, two schools, compliance, Football administrators, AD's, and the NCAA and their crap rule definition. Not saying LAY IT ALL AT THE FEET OF THAT MONSTER, RICH ROD!!! Just that a lot of the confusion came from bringing in new staff, who were doing new things, that they thought was permissible, because the last school they were at had no problem with it, and the administrators screwed up by never putting through the paperwork that would let them decide for themselves if it was ok (and no one will ever know what their decision would have been if they had gotten it, really), and there was blame to go around. But if the same activities were going on when Lloyd was around, it wasn't made clear in the allegations; none of his student assistants were named.  All that was clear was that the paperwork snafu began even before Lloyd had left, so it wasn't Rich coming in and saying "paperwork...we don't need no stinkin' paperwork".  More illustration that it was a conscious decision to bend the rules. He just didn't think it was wrong, and no one told him otherwise (and boy, at the level it was done, it is soooooo minimally wrong to begin with).

restive neb

August 13th, 2010 at 5:23 PM ^

I think you're wrong on the CARA forms.  The NCAA doesn't specifically require the forms, but I believe the NCAA does require that you have evidence that you're following the rules.  The forms are Michigan's chosen way of documenting how they're following the rules.  I believe that not following the University's own procedure for demonstrating compliance means that they are in violation of NCAA rules because they have no means of proving compliance.  It's not the same level of violation, but I'm pretty sure it violates the standards set forth in NCAA rules.  Unless I'm wrong.

M-Wolverine

August 14th, 2010 at 12:52 AM ^

I think I said something to the effect that it did contribute into not having institutional control part because they weren't monitoring it properly.  But I have no problem if that wasn't picked up in my tl;dnr blather of a post. Not monitoring IS a problem...but not so much of one if violations aren't going on.  And the way it was originally worded, it made it sound like the problems were all from that era, and continued on after...and that wasn't the case.

But I have no problem with the way it's been revised. I already knew Tom was a man of character (at least around here...maybe he likes to force puppies to dress as clowns at home...who knows, really, about anybody...). And he just illustrated it again, for everyone. Not because "M-Wolverine" said something, but because he saw a possible misinterpretation, and was man enough to clarify it.

teldar

August 13th, 2010 at 2:26 PM ^

This one should read "If you don't feel passionate about supporting our programs and coaches, please GTFO, you space taking up, non-cheering blue-haired boo-bird, and let someone who's going to make some noise and support the team have a chance at a season ticket.

Ernis

August 13th, 2010 at 2:34 PM ^

This guy is not out of touch. Look at this statement:

The only positive thing I can think of is our new athletic director, but it bothers me he seems to support these coaches and that one of them was on the president’s selection team for his new position.

It's clear indication that this guy could do a better job than David Brandon. He asserts himself with such authority -- he must be an expert! We should all follow this old geezer to the ends of the earth. After all, he is not alone in his sediment ... er, sentiment.

casmooth

August 13th, 2010 at 2:41 PM ^

I think your response is very level headed and shows some valid points.  Sure we are currently struggling, but I think the pieces are in place for good things in the future. 

Engin77

August 13th, 2010 at 2:54 PM ^

assuming he graduated at age 22, would be about 71 now; how many football and basketball seasons does he have left? Clearly he's a guy who glass is 7/8 empty, not 1/8 full. His life must contain more disappointments than UM athletics, but I doubt you'll find him disclosing any of those in a published letter. He makes me sad.

Six Zero

August 13th, 2010 at 3:11 PM ^

it makes a little more sense.  Could you imagine being 75 and knowing you may only have 3-10 more seasons of Michigan football left in your life?

Man, this is too depressing... and scary!  I'm off to the Wolverine Historian channel to feel better.

Search4Meaning

August 13th, 2010 at 3:10 PM ^

Thanks for writing a response that most of us feel is dead on.  You hold your passion in check and use reason as persuasion.  You left the best for last.  Bo's statement is gold.

You are one of the best reasons I love MGoBlog.

Section 1

August 13th, 2010 at 3:27 PM ^

And for "Mr. Class of 1961 in Clarkston," let's remember:

The 1961 Michigan Wolverines were in their 3rd season under Bump Elliott.  They finished their 9-game season at 6-3 overall, 3-3 in the Big Ten.  The medicore season was marked by decisive losses to MSU (28-0), OSU (50-20) and a loss to Minnesota in Minneapolis, depositing the Little Brown Jug with the Gophers.

Now please tell me sir how anybody could have supported such a team?  Just asking.

dahblue

August 13th, 2010 at 4:04 PM ^

6 wins in one season is mediocre to you yet you support RichRod as if he were a superhero? Now, imagine if that 1961 team had 12 games like RR...even if they lost all three it would have been better than RR's winningest season.

I just don't understand how such a blind loyalist like you could insult a former varsity athlete.   How does RR get a complete pass from you, yet this guy (who played for Michigan twice as long as RR has coached and whose father & daughter both lettered at Michigan) gets your ire...Reading these attacks on true Wolverines makes me ill.

Section 1

August 13th, 2010 at 5:44 PM ^

I'm not claiming any superhero status for Coach Rodriguez.  I don't like losing any more than anybody else.  What I am claiming is that the media campaign against Rich Rodriguez -- a campaign that Mr. Class of '61 seems to have wholly bought into -- is garbage.

But really, you tell me; what is Mr. Smith's solution?  Is it to fire Rich Rodriguez?  Is that it?  It might help if the old guy made his wishes clear to the rest of us.  If his serious, publicly-aired (published!) claim is that the Head Coach should be fired, right away, to preserve Mr. Smith's sense of heritage in his alma mater, does he make that case?  Seriously?  What is that case?

Mr. Smith gives us this sort of vague pablum:

Now please ask me how I can support our two major sports teams when our University has let things go so far away from any and every Michigan tradition. 

Huh.  And, uh, what disastrous departures from "any and every Michigan tradition" is he talking about?

I am not alone with this very negative attitude, and only the future will tell the University how its supporters are disgusted. 

That's a fine threat.  One nice thing about Mr. Smith is that we know who he is.  I sort of wish every complainer would come out of the woodwork, by name, and be counted.  And be specific, godammit, about what you think could have been done better.

Why Michigan fell in love with coaches from West Virginia, I have no idea, but they have put us back way before our glory days starting with 1969.  The entire thing makes me upset. 

Yeah.  Whatever.  We feel so bad for you, being upset and all.

The president is very kind to send us all a nice Christmas card every year, but I wish she could understand what is happening on State Street.  The only positive thing I can think of is our new athletic director, but it bothers me he seems to support these coaches and that one of them was on the president’s selection team for his new position.  I would assume his hands are tied for at least the next few years.  Maybe when Michigan gets NCAA sanctions in August, we will all really understand how far we have fallen.  Oh, but the football coach’s job is secure for yet another season.  I guess someone forgot the old and new investments that the University has on State and Stadium streets.

Is this the writing of someone who has an important voice in Michigan Athletics, who has knowledge and experience beyond watching "Michigan Replay with Bo Schembechler" from his couch for 27 years?  Or, does this sound like some old crank, blowing off some mostly unimportant steam?

bringthewood

August 14th, 2010 at 11:18 AM ^

Maybe you have never met a U of M athlete but I've lived with them.  Believe it or not they represent the general poulation, some are great, some are brilliant, and some are stupid.

Please no deifying someone because they are a former Michigan athlete.

dahblue

August 13th, 2010 at 3:56 PM ^

Wow.  I can't believe these comments.  While I have no clue who Mr. Smith is, I feel a need to defend him against the shocking comments I'm reading below.  This guy lettered at the University of Michigan.  His father was a varsity athlete at the University of Michigan.  His daughter was a varsity athlete at the University of Michigan.

For all you who claim to "be all in", "support the team", and whatnot...show some respect.  Respect those Wolverines who came before you just like you do those now playing.  While I might disagree with Mr. Smith's assessment of Beilein, I understand his frustration.  I certainly understand, and agree with, the frustration with RichRod.

The OP's comment is unreal:

Coach Rodriguez came into a difficult situation.  Our football team happened upon a severe lack of depth in talent on both sides of the football, forcing Coach Rodriguez to rebuild from the bottom.  He inherited a compliance issue from the Lloyd Carr era that resulted in NCAA violations.  

RR "came into" an historic program and gave it one of (if not the) worst season ever.  He was not "forced" to rebuild from the bottom.  He chose to.  When you choose to make such a change, you take the risk of heavy scrutiny if it doesn't work.  Then, the most outrageous statement..."RR inherited compliance issues from Carr"???  Are you crazy?  Did Carr coach at WVU, because it looks like (coincidence of coincidences) WVU had the same issues when RR was there.  You blame Lloyd Carr for the sanctions RR brought to Ann Arbor.  Shameful and willfully ignorant.

In closing, have some respect for both your elders and reality.  The OP urges Mr. Smith to support student-athletes.  Mr. Smith raised a Wolverine 4-year letter winner.  He is the son of a Wolverine record-holder.  I think Mr. Smith has done plenty.  If you do want to lobb insults at a Wolverine merely because he's old and doesn't love RR, at least be remotely factually accurate.  If any of you who insult this guy have three generations of varsity Michigan athletes in your family, then maybe you have proper standing to debate the guy.  Otherwise, defer to those who did what you (and I) were not able to.

Go Blue!

Section 1

August 14th, 2010 at 1:01 PM ^

Dahblue -

Wow.  I can't believe these comments.

Wow.  I can't believe your comments.  Or Mr. Smith's:

Maybe when Michigan gets NCAA sanctions in August, we will all really understand how far we have fallen. 

It is of course a dumb statement, rich with evidence of how ill-informed Mr. Smith is.  We're not going to "get NCAA sanctions in August."  There will be a hearing, in which the entire weight of our University, and all of its senior leadership under Mary Sue Coleman and David Brandon, will be asserting that the one NCAA allegation aimed at Rich Rodriguez should be dismissed.

Michigan has sanctioned itself for what the NCAA found, which is wholly unlike anything that the one-man hit squad at the Free Press claimed in a "wildly exaggerated if not flatly incorrect" front-page story.   Without that story, bullshit it was, there'd have been no NCAA investigation.  It was a bullshit story.  They are bullshit allegations.

I'd have some choice words for Mr. Smith in person.  He seems to pin all of his hopes and dreams for the future of Michigan athletics on two coaches from "West Virgina."  Not including, quite apparently, Fielding H. Yost.  He oughtta get with the program, because the program is much bigger than two coaches.

If you care so much for Mr. Smith; I have an idea.  Buy him a computer, and show him how to log on to MGoBlog.  It will be better for him, for his mental health and well-being, and for the good of the University, if he no longer has to get his news about Michigan athletics from his newspaper box.

MGoBender

August 13th, 2010 at 4:55 PM ^

Many things...

Thing the first: This guy did not letter at Michigan.  Or at least did not claim to in his letter.

Thing the second -

RR "came into" an historic program and gave it one of (if not the) worst season ever.  He was not "forced" to rebuild from the bottom.  He chose to.  When you choose to make such a change, you take the risk of heavy scrutiny if it doesn't work.  Then, the most outrageous statement...

RR came into a historic program that was had an unusual lack of depth of talent, specifically on the defensive side of the football and at the QB position.  If that's not a recipe for disaster, I don't know what is.  He was hired to bring the spread offense to Michigan.  Did you want him to completely ignore everything he's done, ignore his expertise, ignore the reason he was hired because it would have been too drastic of a change?  He was hired to make that change.  Again, placed in a very difficult situation.

Thing the third -

He inherited a compliance issue from the Lloyd Carr era that resulted in NCAA violations. 

That's my quote.  This is yours:

Then, the most outrageous statement..."RR inherited compliance issues from Carr"???  Are you crazy?  Did Carr coach at WVU, because it looks like (coincidence of coincidences) WVU had the same issues when RR was there.  You blame Lloyd Carr for the sanctions RR brought to Ann Arbor.  Shameful and willfully ignorant.

Did I say he inherited compliance issues from Carr?  Read again, it's right there.  Did I blame Lloyd Carr at all?  Read again, it's right there.  I said the Lloyd Carr era, subtle but huge difference.  I was actually referring to Labadie and Draper who were both in the compliance office under Carr and who both are majorly responsible for the CARA forms not being brought to RR's knowledge.  I have since changed my quote because of this misunderstanding, but if people read closely, it should be clear.

Thing the final:

Mr. Smith raised a Wolverine 4-year letter winner.  He is the son of a Wolverine record-holder.  I think Mr. Smith has done plenty.  If you do want to lobb insults at a Wolverine merely because he's old and doesn't love RR, at least be remotely factually accurate.

And he graduated from Michigan!  What a great man!  As such, he should know better!  Any coach or parent of athletes should understand that losing is part of the game.  It happens.  When my sons play on a baseball team that loses am I going to demand a new little league coach?  Nope.  And I wouldn't if they were playing at the college level either.  Because you're upset with losing doesn't mean you lobby for the Board of Regents and the President of the University to fire the football coach, which is exactly what he did. 

Where did I lob insults?  Where was I inaccurate?  The man asked for a reason to support.  I gave him one.  I gave him many.

raleighwood

August 14th, 2010 at 12:18 AM ^

While reading your comments, I knew that you'd get negged to death because that's just how things roll on MGoBlog.  Everything you said is true (and you certainly have your right to express your opinion) but people don't really want to hear the truth....they want you to toe the party line.  That's a fact of life in 2010.  I can deal with that.

I'm with you (although not necessarily Mr. Smith) in this.  Respect for the institution and those who came before has been thrown out the window.  I think that it's a generational thing.  Now it's more about slogans and rally cries than an actual deep concern for tradition and honor.  That's fine too.  I understand that not everybody will "get it".

Just stick to your guns, one way or another, things are going to get better.

Go Blue!

 

 

mtzlblk

August 14th, 2010 at 6:37 AM ^

Both my parents went to M (met there actually, Dad also went to law school there), as did my brother and sister. I grew up going to every home game and a few away games, spending the whole day in Ann Arbor hearing about what it was like to go there and dreaming of going there myself. I grew up in East Lansing, my mom's from Columbus and every time we lose i get a large scarlet & grey sheet cake from her side of the family who still refer to her as a traitor for going to M, some 50 years later. We all listened to Bob Ufer announce the away games, I had the privilege of meeting Bo as a kid.

I have lived and breathed M sports for the entirety of my 42 years on this planet. My room was blue carpet, maize walls. On spirit day in school before the UM/MSU game I was one of maybe 5 Michigan fans to proudly wear my gear, even if it meant getting beat up, which in 6th grade against eight graders it usually did.

I get 'it' as much as anybody 'gets' it. I grew up seeing the difference between M and other programs. I have always taken pride in being one of the cleaner (not perfect) programs in college football. I understand completely the honor and tradition of athletics at UM, especially the football program. In fact, I hold it very dear to my heart and it is the core of my fandom.

 I just see a completely different side to RR than you do.

If you want to indict his character because of a hit job from some money-grubbing local journalists, be my guest, but don't hold yourself up as some bastion of honor and integrity and bemoan the passing of some bygone era that never existed.

On the one hand, you have an institution, at which RR is the coach, that committed infractions that in the general scheme of things are pretty small potatoes. Furthermore, they did so out of a genuine misinterpretation of a very vaguely defined set of rules. Our program was in the process of self-reporting these issues, correcting them and  being forthright and honest about the whole situation. Pete Carroll, Lane Kiffin and USC this is not. Unfortunately, before M could work through the proper channels, a few journalists with a published bias decided to turn it into a smear campaign. If you want to cry about a bygone era and the loss of honesty and integrity, you should start there.

On the other hand, you have a guy who has stood behind the Mealers and before anything else, told Elliot his scholarship is safe even if he never plays again, then brought to bear the entire M program to help them in their time of need, including oodles of time from one of the most important members of his staff to help in Brock's rehab. Dishonorable? I see a coach who is a pretty strict disciplinarian, tossing players who cross the line off the team, regardless of their importance. I see someone requiring his players to give and to be involved in their community. I see him spending time at Mott's and even taking time out of his schedule to sit with a family of M fans whose baby wasn't going to last the night. I see a coach who is installing a work ethic that i think would have impressed Bo himself, i think Bo would be behind everything RR has done 100%. I hear from parents of players and parents of recuits, not to mention the players and recruits themselves, praising the atmosphere the coaches have developed and the set of values being taught. In short, I see a lot of clear evidence to the contrary that RR is lacking in character.

Can I ask you a question? Do you not know about any of the positive stuff, does it not matter to you, or do you just not care? Seriously, would you let a few too many minutes of practice and a few staffers watching some activities they shouldn't blind you to any kind of evidence that would indicate that RR is not completely devoid of morals?

raleighwood

August 14th, 2010 at 9:26 AM ^

Your response was well thought out but I think that you took it too personally....particularly in respect to RR.  I never even mentioned him.  I think that RR is probabIy a pretty decent guy and I never questioned his integrity.  I like they way that he's dealt with the Mealer situation and discipline issues on the team.

I  simply stated that I agreed with much of what the previous writer had to say and I knew that he'd get negged for simply offering a different point of view.

People are jumping all over Mr Smith (a 70+ year old man) because he stated an opinion that was contrary to theirs.  That's where I see the breakdown and lack of respect for those who came before.  I don't necessarily agree with Mr Smith (particularly on the basketball side) but I don't have a problem with a man who has invested a lot into the university stating his opinion.

mtzlblk

August 16th, 2010 at 11:02 AM ^

sorry if i took it too personally, but you did say 'they' and imply that 'we' don't get the honor and tradition of the university, which, well, we'll leave it at that. I get it in spades.

There certainly are people on here that don't want to hear the truth, and they are getting negged for it. It is not me. I have read everything written about the situation.....thoroughly. I availed myself of knowledge provided by those with better insight into football than I. I digested it all, then I made up my own mind.

Just being an athlete at UM doesn't give someone carte blanche to write damaging letters to an alumnae publication, especially one that makes it soooo clear that he doesn't know anything about what he is talking about. People like that, who spout off about honor, integrity and tradition, should take a long look at themselves before they open their mouths because chances are, like T.H. Smith, they embody none of those traits. Mr. Smith seems to revel in the glory of his Dad's success and that of his kids, but he himself never did anything beyond graduate, go to some games and donate, none of which entitle him to whatever special consideration he believes he is due. He is not special and he is the PROBLEM with our fanbase, NOT the solution. There is nothing honorable about what he wrote. There is no integrity in his support for his team crumpling after a few down years and certainly none in threatening to pull his Victors Club donation because he doesn't get enough W, and if he really had any idea about tradition he wouldn't let a few down years out of 100 bother him so much. HE IS THE DEFINITION OF A BAD FAN. THE WORST KIND. If he were a real fan, he would be cheering harder for his team, not whining, like a bitch.

The poster that you indicated would get negged for offering a different viewpoint deserves his negs. He is of the exact same ilk as T.H. Smith and can't be bothered to actually apprise himself of the facts before coming on here and slandering the coach and at every turn attempting to crucify him. He is on here incessantly, on any post that would deem to support Rich Rodriguez or mitigate his culpability in any of the current mess, spouting off with his obtuse, simple opinion that 'Rich Rod is BAD'. When pressed for a rationale for that opinion, he will equivocate, he will dodge questions until finally, he retreats to '8-16!!! Sanctions!!!!! Unacceptable!!!', because he knows nothing about the situation other than that his tiny little identity is suffering a crisis because his team isn't winning as much as he wants them to. Don't believe me? Here is his latest gem,  and I quote:  

http://mgoblog.com/mgoboard/reaction-richrod-situation-freep#comment-578566

 

This is simple: 

-Violations in the entire history of Michigan football prior to RR = 0

-Violations under RR = 5/6/whatever

-Possible sanctions for RR's prior program = on the way

There is nothing simple about the current situation. The only simple thing is his opinion.....and him, apparently. He is a lemming, a rube. He is just the type of fan that the Free Press articles are written for, those who read headlines, don't know much else, and could care less about the facts behind a story. This guy wants to complain and no amount of evidence is going to stop him, or even give him pause to consider that perhaps he is wrong.

I have chatted with many people on this board that do not support Rodriguez. People that have a coherent argument for not supporting him and a solid rationale for why they don't and typically it is because they question his ability, as a coach, to be successful at Michigan. I respect that, hell, I might even agree with them in some respects. But their judgement is based on analysis and some knowledge of what they are talking about.

This is different. This guy doesn't 'like' him and for him it is personal. I don't kow exactly what his slant or bias is, but he is the purest form of bandwagon fan that exists. He pukes and mewls about, 'it should be okay to criticize something you love' and calls anyone that asks him to defend his statements 'blind loyalists', which we are not. We are just not stupid enough to be lead around by the nose by a some journalists with a well-known and articulated bias against the coach. Yes, it is okay to criticize and debate, NO it is not okay to incessantly attack, slander, undermine and in general just whine about the coach after only 2 years of rebuilding.

Read his comments here about accusing Rich Rodriguez of 'choosing to rebuild the team', as if there was a choice. He was hired to do a job and he is doing it, that job being the evolution of M football into a modern, competitive football program that will remain competitive for a long time. This guy knows NOTHING about football and actually thinks RR could get by on some sort of hybrid for years until his spread was in place, which is assinine.

dahblue

August 16th, 2010 at 12:08 PM ^

"This guy" here...

Looks like you can't get enough of trashing and negging me, neither of which I give a shit about.  It's almost funny that you even bash me when responding to someone else.  

I'm not sure how much more clear I can make it, but the "media" is not what led me to form my views about RR.  His coaching performance has led me to that opinion.  What are the "facts behind the story"?  Would we have won 9 games if the media were nicer to RR?  Of course not.  There is nothing hidden in the on-the-field results.  

To you, RR can do no wrong.  Good for you.  You feel that RR did the right thing in his method of rebuilding a team that had never gone 3-9 previously, a team that had a record bowl streak, a team that never before was sanctioned by the NCAA.  Ok.  Again, good for you.  It is perfectly logical and reasonable, however, for a person to find such facts unacceptable.  You'd be perfectly content with the coach benching a QB who doesn't perform, yet you defend endlessly a coach who has failed.  To me, both that QB and the coach can prove their value by improving performance.  For you, only the QB needs to do so.  That's the difference between a blind loyalist (you) and a realist (me).

mtzlblk

August 16th, 2010 at 6:58 PM ^

Of course I outline your opinion for him, that was the crux of his statement, I was showing him why you were getting negged. So?

....and again your superficial (at best) knowledge of the reality of the situation is plain for all to see, you do a great job of trashing yourself just by commenting.

I would NOT be content with a coach benching a QB for not performing, not if that QB was sent onto the field with 9 players rather than 11 and was given two series in which to produce results after learning an entirely new offense in the off-season. That would be silly. Especially if that QB had performed more than admirably in every game up to that point. Apparently, you would be on the sidelines yelling 'unacceptable' in his face as he came off the field.

I won't argue that 8-16 is a fact, but if you only concern yourself with one fact in the whole situation, you are leaving yourself a bit light on information, which I can only perceive as an omission of convenience on your part to keep things simple.

Feckless.

blueheron

August 14th, 2010 at 8:53 AM ^

"... I knew that you'd get negged to death because that's just how things roll on MGoBlog."

You're mistaken on that.  This is, honestly, one of the most civilized Michigan sports sites I've seen.  Ever spend time on MLive?

"Everything you said is true..."

Right... all RichRod had to do in '08 was run a "pro-style" offense with future NFL gunslingers Threet and Sheridan and we would have wound up playing in a BCS game.  Sure!

"... people don't really want to hear the truth..."

I'm with you on this one.  They certainly don't want to hear that '05, '06, and '07 have proven to be mediocre (if not miserable) recruiting years.  They don't want to hear about how the O-line tradition (David Baas and Jake Long aside) had been trashed in Lloyd's last years.  No, no.  ME FEEL BAD!  RICHROD BAD COACH!

"Respect for the institution and those who came before has been thrown out the window.  ... Now it's more about slogans and rally cries than an actual deep concern for tradition and honor."

Elaborate, *please*.  That is hopelessly vague and you sound as slimy as Mr. Smith.  You're hoping to stir emotions and then direct them to your goal (hiring Brady Hoke, perhaps).

"Go Blue!"

But don't even THINK of treating the current coach fairly, 'k?

Section 1

August 14th, 2010 at 12:57 PM ^

I graduated 30 years ago.  Rick Leach did too.  So did David Brandon.

Why don't you explain, in detail, why "Respect for the institution and those who came before has been thrown out the window"?  Where, and how, would you like to see a greater demonstration of "actual deep concern for tradition and honor"?

Be very specific.  You really nedd to explain what you are talking about.

As for me, it is not complicated.  I support Michigan football.  I support it with my money, and with my enthusiasm.  Also, my loyalty.  I don't have any trouble whatsoever with throwing all of my enthusiastic support behind the Michigan football team and its head coach.  You seem to have a problem with that.  For reasons that you haven't even made clear, save for the vaguest imaginable phrases about "Respect... tradtition and honor."

mtzlblk

August 15th, 2010 at 3:09 PM ^

Your quest on this board to bring whatever negative comments you can against RR are simply laughable and Quixotic.

Are you old, stupid, or both? Are you mad at Rich because he won't go back to using leather helmets the way you want him to? Are your taters not soft enough to gum?

Let me guess what your arguments are going to be this time, '8-16!!!, sanctions!!! unacceptable!!!!' Try reading beyond the headlines a bit, it would help you. If you can't spend the time to fully understand the issues, then you are nothing more than a rube to those journalists that will do anything for $$.

Not everyone who supports RR is a blind loyalist. We understand something about the game of football and have some notion of the situation that Rodriguez walked into in terms of the state of the program. We will form our opinions when the results on the field are evident and then we will make judgments on his coaching abilities. We will not, as you have been, be duped into an opinion by the petty slanderings of a few yellow journalists out for a buck. Two years of results are not a referendum on any coach, much less one making the radical changes in personnel and scheme that are taking place at Michigan. If he doesn't have them poised to be contenders for the next 10-15 years at the end of a 4 year stint, then it didn't work out. When Bo came on, he did not bring with him a radically new scheme. The one change he planned on making was a switch to a 5-man angled defensive front, which he guaranteed to have working in 5 years. 

I have said it before and will say it again, you are the worst kind of fair-weather fan, because you don't just disappear when your team is down, you turn on them. Of course it is okay to criticize the program and the coach. No one here is advocating putting on blinders or maize colored glasses and granting anyone a free pass for anything. But what you do is waaaay beyond that, you are here every day, on any post that would deem to support Rich Rodriguez in any way and attempting to slander him and add your bitter, negative spin on whatever is being discussed.

You and those of your ilk are lemmings that read a few headlines and rather than take the time to understand the complexity of the situation, are going to run straight off a cliff with a Free Press in your hand bemoaning the death of some impossible, unrealistic ideal that quite simply doesn't exist and never did. 

Your comments show such a decided lack of any football knowledge that it is hard to even take you seriously sometimes. 'Chose to rebuild'? Are you serious? So he should have done what...created a hybrid of the previous scheme and the one he planned to implement and tried to field a part pro-style offense and part spread? How long should he be in that transitory state and, pray tell, how do you recruit for that? 'Hey, Devin, come play here, we are going to be doing pro-style offense for a few more years and so i will be getting a big slow guy to manage the team for the next few years and I will try to work you in as we switch over to the spread. Oh, hey, big, slow pro-style QB, come play here so I can replace you in a year or two with my spread guy.' Do you have any idea how disastrous that would be to the program over the long term? Actually, no, you probably don't.

I have respect for people that earn it....like people that stand behind things they believe in, not people who turn to butter the second things get a little heated and start whining like little kids because their team isn't winning enough. Elders only earn respect when they act in a manner that warrants it, you aren't automatically owed any semblance of respect just because of your age. That is not new, that has always been the case. Perhaps that is part of your problem? You don't deserve any, at least in this instance. You are a fickle, chinless, cowardly fan.....as is T.H. Smith. Neither of you has any yarbles when it comes to Michigan football. You should be 10 times as vehement in your support when they are down. I don't care how many varsity letter winners at UM Mr. Smith raised, nor that his father was one. He wasn't. Both of my parents went to UM, I went to UM, my brother and sister both went to U of M. All of us received academic scholarships, I and my brother both have graduate degrees from there. Guess what? That doesn't give me any more license than any other fan to be a prick and spout off unreasonably at every turn.

Read that quote from Bo at the end of the OP's letter, he is talking DIRECTLY to you and those like you and telling you not to be such a wussy.

dahblue

August 15th, 2010 at 10:00 PM ^

Wow, that's a long rant.  Frankly, there just isn't any point in verbally jousting with cowards like you.  You don't exist in real life because no one is so stupid to forward such viewpoints publicly.  You circle your little wagons in the mgobubble so as not to realize that the vast majority of alums find your blind loyalty to be sad.  

You can call me names, challenge my fandom, etc.  I just don't care.  I'm been a Michigan fan my entire life.  I'm a Michigan fan now and will be one until the day I die.  I believe in the TEAM.  The coach is not bigger than the team.  I'm bright enough to realize that just wearing the uniform (or headset) doesn't make a person infallible.   QB's sometimes need to be replaced.  RB's the same.  Defensive coordinators.  Even head coaches.  You say I "turned on the team".  No, you turned on the team by blinding supporting a coach who has done great damage to our program.  We've lost 16 games in two seasons.  We have been hit with NCAA sanctions.  We are now recruiting against the likes of Army and Florida Atlantic.  RichRod has one year left to reverse his damage.  Otherwise, you'll be riding a new bandwagon next season.

mtzlblk

August 16th, 2010 at 1:13 AM ^

8-9 paragraphs would seem quite long to someone accustomed to just reading the headlines before opening their mouth to spew venom about the program you profess to love.

Not worth it eh...that's the biggest cop out ever, but then again, I wouldn't expect you to stick with it, sticking with things doesn't seem to be your strong suit, while quitting on things would be. How many times can you type "8-16!!! Sanctions!!!" anyway?

Trust me, I know quite a few alumnae myself (the proper plural for alumnus, speaking of stupidity) and the vast majority of them support RR and believe me, I'm more than willing to discuss this face to face with anybody, M alumnae, opposing fans....anybody, in person. Indeed I have on many more occasions than I have posted on here. That is the difference between you and I, I will defend the program, here or face-to-face, while you choose to puss out. If you think my opinions are only expressed on here, hardly, not even close.

The vast majority? Perhaps the ones that live in the same extended care facility you do, but certainly not a majority. It is sad to hear that you are familiar with that many M 'alums' that know or care so little about the program that all they think about about are W and Ls and can't be bothered, like you, to delve into the reality of the situation and take the time to understand what is actually going on.

Again, I would implore you to read more than the free press and arm yourself with knowledge and facts rather than blind rhetoric. To simply point to 8-16 and whimper about M possibly facing sanctions for the first time is an incredibly disappointing level if dedication on your part as a 'fan'. You are a rube, nothing more, nothing less.

Since you are not a fan unless the team wins, so let's hope you get to be a fan again real soon and stay one for a loong time and never have to puss out again.

AAL

August 14th, 2010 at 5:41 AM ^

...reminded me of the speech at the climax of the movie The American President:

"We have serious problems to solve, and we need serious people to solve them. And whatever your particular problem is, I promise you, Bob Rumson [ed: people like Mr. Smith] is not the least bit interested in solving it. He is interested in two things and two things only: making you afraid of it and telling you who's to blame for it. That, ladies and gentlemen, is how you win elections [ed: get your way because you are an alum with dollars]. You gather a group of middle-aged, middle-class, middle-income voters who remember with longing an easier time, and you talk to them about family and American [Michigan] values and character."