I'm still curious about the creation of truly "new" michigan football legends since every player that has the potential will be given one of these numbers correct? Since we just started this last year will Denard be the last number he wore on his own that could be become a legend?
Future Michigan Football Legends Criteria?
Since Desmond became a Michigan Football Legend at last year's UTL, I have been thinking about how future players would be deemed worthy of Legend status. I turned to the College Football Hall of Fame for insight on their criteria for election into the Hall. My thought was that this would give us a good size group to choose from given that we already have 30 players elected. This is the first criteria:
All of the current Legends qualify under this criteria except for Ford (I think we can give Presidents a pass on this one).
Here is the list of First Team All-Americans:
|1||Paul Goebel, Anthony Carter, Derrick Alexander, David Terrell, Braylon Edwards|
|2||Jack Blott, Charles Woodson|
|3||Tripp Welborne, Marlin Jackson|
|4||Jim Harbaugh, Marquise Walker|
|6||Harry Kipke, Dave Brown|
|11||Francis Wistert, Albert Wistert, Alvin Wistert|
|17||Ted Petoskey, Larry Foote|
|19||Robert Brown, Remy Hamilton|
|24||Jack Clancy, Butch Woolfolk|
|25||Tom Edwards, Tom Curtis, Ernest Shazor|
|27||Benny Friedman, Charles Bernard|
|30||Harry Hawkins, Brad Cochran|
|35||Thom Darden, Don Dufek|
|37||Jim Smith, Erick Anderson, Jarrett Irons|
|40||Ron Johnson, Ron Simpkins|
|41||Randy Logan, Rob Lytle|
|45||William Daley, Pete Elliott|
|49||Robert Chappuis, Richard Volk|
|50||Otto Pommerening, David Molk|
|60||Mark Donahue, Mark Messner|
|65||Reggie McKenzie, Kurt Becker|
|67||Mervin Pregulman, John Vitale|
|69||Tom Dixon, Matt Elliott, Jon Runyan|
|72||Allen Wahl, Dan Dierdorf, Walt Downing, Ed Muransky, John Elliott|
|75||William Yearby, William Paris, Greg Skrepenak, David Baas|
|76||Stefan Humphries, Steve Hutchinson|
|77||Arthur Walker, Paul Seymour, Jon Jansen, Jake Long, Taylor Lewan|
|86||Robert Westfall, John Anderson|
|87||Edward Frutig, Ronald Kramer|
|88||Elmer Madar, Jim Mandich|
|96||Calvin O'Neal, William Carr|
Obviously this list is plenty long enough for multiple lifetimes of Michigan Football Legends Ceremonies, but using this criteria, can you really keep Michigan's All-Time leading rusher (Mike Hart) from getting a patch? I guess the real question is how do we separate a great player from a Michigan Legend?
At least the next two (after Harmon) are pretty easy in my opinion. Anthony Carter (three time first team All America) and Charles Woodson (Heisman). The hard part will be trying to find someone to wear those numbers, given what Hoke has already said about them being special. It should be fun.
Possibly, but the way I see it, the jerseys have been given to only very good players. Perhaps in the future if a standout player has a real shot of becoming a Legend, he'll keep his normal jersey number. As to your final question, Denard, as much as I love him, will not have his jersey become part of the Legends program.
One possibility is that they would use the number the player originally wore before getting the Legends digits. Not implying that Jake Ryan is legend material but, for example, they could use his number 90. This is suboptimal in my opinion, but they'll have many years to figure it out.
contribution that is revered over time and not merely a set of achievements?
In essence, I think it boils down to a group of people deciding a player has made a momentous contribution to the reputation of UM football.
Here is the hard question: does/can Tom Brady achieve Legend status if his NFL career continues for 5 more illustrious years and he sets a bunch of records?
Unless he can do something greater than being the best NFL quarterback of all time. That's is how hard it should be if your college career alone doesn't warrant the patch.
The #1 jersey needs a patch with ANTHONY CARTER'S name on it. He was a 3-time all-american. There are only 2 3-timers in school history. Other one is Oosterbaan.
And they need to get rid of the criteria of #1 going to the best WR. Give to the best player who shows leadership.
46 also needs to be a Legends number for Harry Newman. He won the Fairbanks Award his senior season which was the Heisman before the Heisman.
After a quick Google search he is definitely getting a patch. DB actually mentions the Fairbanks Award in one of his blog post, so plans are probably in the works.
Ugh, the more I think about this, the worse it gets.
I will always remember Jordan Kovacs as #32, regardless of what Legends number he is given.
Basically, we have a cycle of preventing a player from becoming his own legend.
1. Player starts with a number
2. Player gets good
3. Player becomes great
4. Player is given someone else's number
5. Player does not have chance to earn his own "legend" status.
Unless they add names to numbers (and for godssake make the patch smaller and much more obscure).
Agree. Couldn't we replace giving the active player the retired number with just giving the him the Legends patch?
I would hope they wouldn't switch his number. I think they should give them out to freshman. Then we will see the numbers make their way onto the field through the years. Also the odds of one of the becoming a legend is so small it might never happen, but if it does.... great.
Tom from AA hit it right on, the prevention of kids making a jersey number his own legend is my biggest concern with the system
If another #21 won the Heisman, I don't think it would take anything away from either player by honoring them both. It would also make the number more special.
Is it just me, or is this whole LEGENDS PATCH! thing more of a headache than it's worth?
It's you and everyone else who like to take fun things like this and make them into headaches in the first place.
This should be a fun discussion of how to honor great players, not a headache.
If I remember correctly, Brandon's goal with the "legends" program was to get the old numbers back in circulation not to look for opportunities to get more numbers into legend status. Because of this, a player will darn near have to walk on water to get there number legendified. That is after #1 and #2 are legendified.
the term legend implies a rare level that only a few people can achieve over time. the person would have to stand the test of time.
the retired numbers qualify, likely heisman trophy winners as well.
the idea that kovacs (a great person and decent safety), would be a legend is hard to swallow. hart was good and gained lots of yard but is he even a top 5, top 10 michigan rb of all time? the little brother quote was legendary, though
woodson's legend continues to grow every year-- he seems like a legend. we all wanted brady benched for henson--nfl hall of fame-yes michigan legend- i doubt it.
if there are more than 10 or 12 legends -the term would become meaningless.
Especially when we have no idea how long this program will last. We may be at ten already, if you count past players who are guaranteed a patch. In the next 100 years we should have another ten (hopefully).
Be careful, HELLE: only THE_KNOWLEDGE is allowed to look into the future. All others who presume to do so are subject to severe temporal anomalies.
In my opinion, the only two that deserve a patch who I've seen play are AC and Woodson. I was born in the mid 70s but started going to games before I can remember. Carter was just a man among boys and gave Bo no choice but the throw the ball, and Woodson's Heisman season was the most incredible displays of football I have ever seen.
There have many great players during the nearly 40 years I've been on this planet, but these two are the only ones that I still marvel at (even more so than Desmond).
Facial hair should be the biggest criterion IMO
Come on down Elliot Mealer!
I think fans are making too big of a deal about new legends making a number for themselves.
1. Anyone offered a legends jersey can turn it down. They don't just hand you the jersey in front of everyone out of no where, and make you look like a jerk for turning it down. Hoke has discussions with the players behind closed doors. If someone wants to have their own number immortalized, I highly doubt we would ever hear that they turned down a legends jersey.
2. The players want a legends Jersey. Braylon asked for number 1, and Carr made him prove it on the field before giving it to him. It is an honor to wear these jerseys for the players. Why did Junior Hemmingway wear 21? I am sure he wanted to honor Desmond even before the legends patch came about.
3. As the long list above shows, we have a lot of legends with a wide variety of numbers. Even if the legends jerseys didn't exist, wearing number 2 in the secondary will always make us think Charles Woodson first and foremost. It doesn't matter how good the player turns out. Same goes for 77 and Jake Long, or 20 for Mike Hart. Maybe I was to young & naive, but seeing Michael Shaw run around the backfeild with the number 20 on, made me think he had some upside. Adding a legends patch just makes it official that we are recognizing the talents of this athlete to live up to the expectations of the legend(s) who wore that number before him.
You can't be considered "great," let alone "legendary" if you never beat Ohio State.
must be part of the criteria in my opinion. They say it is all about winning the Big Ten and beating Ohio.