CC Update - Stoops, Mullen, Patterson, Graham Stock Up - Jones Falls
We are deep enough into the night to get a good idea of how our potential coaching candidates are doing. Rather than ordering them I will do a tier system of sorts.
My personal tiers would be
- Unicorn: Jim Harbaugh
- Michigan Man: Les Miles
- America's #1 Candidate: Dan Mullen
- Just Win Baby: Gary Patterson, Todd Graham
- The Next Hot One?: Mark Stoops
- Poor Man's Brian Kelly: Butch Jones
Everyone has difference preferences but I'd basically tier Harbaugh alone, then tier Mullen, Patterson, and Graham together. Miles would be in his own tier - if you'd place him above or below the trio of Mullen/Patterson/Graham - that is up to personal preference - an argument can be made either way. Once you get past that group of 5 you move to Tier B guys and the top name there might be Mark Stoops who has a small HC resume so we are getting real time data by the week. He also seems to me to be the 1 candidate if offered we'd have a >50% chance of landing. Everyone else I'd put anywhere from 2% (Patterson) to 30% (Miles?). Stoops lack of HC resume and current location - while potential issues - are exactly why he would be the most likely to come if offered.
Yes there are other candidates but I'd put these in the world of reality with track records as HCs we can realistically evaluate vs a non Big 5 conference HC, or any coordinator or any NFL guy.
Updates on all below....
I won't speak much to Harbaugh or Miles for obvious reasons - everyone knows their stories. Harbaugh is the #1 candidate - the unicorn. There is no question about his coaching, the only questions have to do with availability and interest. I won't put a probability of him coming to Michigan out there because only he knows but let's say its smallish. And if he did come his name would be in the NFL rumor mill to leave every winter.
Miles is in a good situation for him. He'd only leave if his heart wins over his mind IMO. While in a tough division there is a lot more that you can get away with in his part of the country in terms of JUCO transfers, academic qualifications, and "oversigning". Age is an issue for some but not to me - get 5-6 years out of him and rebuild a tree. The only question is how effective he'd be here vs the SEC with how they recruit. He also had some alleged Oklahoma State "issues" that some "Michigan Men" would have an issue with. You'd at least be guaranteed a very good defense which he has had almost every year; offensive results are middling but he has a very young team that should be far better next year than this.
I've seen enough of Todd Graham to be sold - guy just wins. The Pac 12 South is the 2nd toughest conference in America at this time and he has the scalps of Stanford and USC (albeit with a Hail Mary) in the past 2 weeks - with a brand new defense and a backup QB at the helm. Winning that USC game is not that important - the fact he took a team with 9 new defensive starters, including 3 true freshman starters (Not Jabrill Peppers level but Lawrence Marshall, Brandon Watson level freshman) and molded a team that can at least hang around on the road vs a top 20 opponent is impressive. But they indeed even found a way to win. That is a very brutal conference for defenses makes me bow down in awe when I see what product we are putting out - we have 3rd year players looking lost; I can't imagine multiple true freshmen being asked to do so much. His starting QB is a 2 star who he has molded into top 3 in the conference - and he has been hurt v UCLA, USC, Stanford. Yes they had a blowout v UCLA but that stuff happens every so often and it came righ after Kelly was hurt. dFEI has been 20s to 30s in his 3 years at ASU; combine with a top 10 oFEI last year and this year. The 2 deep is also stacked with youth - only 7 seniors; team will be loaded for bear next year. Guy just wins - I dont care if they go 8-4 or 10-2 this year; on paper that team should have taken a big step back this year with the personnel losses. It didn't. That's a winner. Lack of Midwest exposure is his main drawback other than "he is a meanie pants".
The criticism of Dan Mullen coming into this year was no major wins over quality opponents in 5 years. I am still not 100% sold on him - is he having a great year or has he built a great program? Is he the man that will beat MSU 2/3rds of the time and OSU 1/2? I don't know. Obviously a major upgrade over current guy but that is a low bar - I find other candidates more proven. But he is currently the most popular name among the masses and today won a tricky game vs Kentucky on the road. A rapidly improving Kentucky. Last we saw of Mullen he had put victories over LSU, Texas A&M, and Auburn back to back. LSU is young but still a tough venue, A&M was overrated but still a solid win, and Auburn is still a bit of a mystery (currently tied with South Carolina 21-21 at half as I type) - still a good gauntlet. While from PA his coaching background has been mostly in FL and MS - not the Midwest.
Speaking of Kentucky that brings us to Mark Stoops. Who had taken 2-10 Kentucky from a year ago to a team that was down 38-31 to Miss State with minutes to go in the game. I cannot even fathom UM hosting the #1 team in the country in year 3-4 of a program that was in far worse shape than UM ever was and living to tell the tale. Kentucky went on the road and was destroyed last week v LSU - again, that happens. What I want to see in years 2-3 of a coach is a trend. Is there a significant win that is an outlier (Harbaugh pulled off upsets of #7 Oregon and USC back to back in year 3, in an otherwise average 8-5 year). This was an impressive loss - and yes moral victories in year 2 of your program, a year removed from back to back 2-10 years do count. When last we looked at Stoops we said he needed either a big victory or a very competitive loss to be taken seriously - he just got that. One could argue he is doing more in year 2 with a tire fire that is Kentucky than Harbaugh did in year 2 at Stanford. Stoops has a challenging finish to the year with Georgia, @Louisville, @Missouri, and @Tennessee. Three road games... go 2-2, and make the Georgia loss (if its a loss) competitive like you did tonight v Miss State and I am willing to believe. Especially the way he is recruiting and the fact that outside of Harbaugh he best fits the profile of a Midwest coach... and has proven elite success on 1 side of the ball. He "feels" more like older brother Bob than Mike. Out of the "tier B" choices, he seems like he should be the top of the list if the next month goes well. If UK does well next year i.e. 9-3ish, he would be next year's Dan Mullen - but he would have done it in half the time it took Mullen. Big if, eh?
Next, Mr Patterson whose team put up 82 on Texas Tech today. Damn. Patterson has had elite defenses for years and the offense is hit or miss. Years he has had good offenses the team is top 10-15ish. This is one of those years.... and now he is doing it in a Big 5 conference. Even more impressive, Patterson had a run based offense that worked fine in the Mountain West but failed for 2 years in the Big 12. Was he stubborn and "stuck to it"? No - he demoted his OC and got 2 new Air Raid OCs. He changed systems on the fly - and put a bunch of players that were not recruited for that system out there - and is flourshing. I am told that is impossible - how can you recruit players for system A and just put them out there in system B. Well he did it. I think of all the candidates he is the least likely to come to UM - first due to his affinity for TCU, second for his tenure, and third - there really is no reason to come to UM. He has TCU at the top of a Power 5 conference challenging for a playoff spot at a school he can continue to do that for a long time, and not in a conference that is like the SEC West. But he would be an ideal candidate other than lack of Midwest background. But I think him coming to UM is probably below Harbaugh's chances at this point.
Butch Jones has sort of flat lined - tonight they are hosting Alabama without their starting QB (I believe?) and losing 27-0 in the 2nd as I type. 0-3 in the SEC in year 3 ...that said a BRUTAL schedule but 2 of those losses were absolute blowouts and tonight will be blowout #3. If you are going to lose - lose some of them close and not just vs a bad Florida team. Mark Stoops "feels" like he has more upside to me already. If Jones was born in Virginia and coached at Marshall ....rather than born in Michigan and coached at Central I don't think people would be as high on him. He has sort of followed Brian Kelly around everywhere and done a step below. I want the next guy to have a chance to be Brian Kelly or better; not 1 step below. Stock is down.
October 25th, 2014 at 9:36 PM ^
Free Jim Tressel
He'd beat MSU "all of the time" and tOSU 50/50 at minimum.
If not Tressel, then hire the hatter.
October 25th, 2014 at 9:57 PM ^
Harbaugh and Mullen are most likely not coming but would be great pick ups.
I just dont see it in Miles, it sure would be an upgrade over Hoke, but still I think the time to get him was 07.
I would love getting Graham as well. His offense seem to always be in the top 30 (except Pitt). His defenses have been somewhat shaky. At Tulsa he basically out scored his oppoenents. At that one year at Pitt, his defense kept him in the game. Then he had a top 40 and top 30 defense in 2012 and 2013 but this year has a bottom 40 D. However he wins and winning the PAC 12 is harder than the B1G 10 for sure.
October 25th, 2014 at 10:51 PM ^
What I found looking at a LOT of coaches the past month is its almost impossible to create a top notch defense at these schools like Cincinnati, Houston, Tulsa, wherever. You can do it in a power 5 conference or if you are at say TCU for 15 years.
But creative coaches can turn programs around quickly with offenses. Defense is defense - you need players/athletes. Offense you can offset the type of athletic deficiency with (a) a good QB and (b) scheme. You could argue that is what Indiana is doing. They have no defense, just trying to win games on scheme.
Not sure why people assume Graham is not concerned abuot defense. He wasnt at Tulsa. But once he got to ASU he had the 2nd ranked defense in year 1 there (in the Pac 12, only behind Stanford), the 4th ranked defense in year 2 (Stanford, USC, Oregon), and I havent looked this year but they should be awful on defense this year with 9 new starters. Again consider the talent they have vs what Oregon and USC gets and Stanford increasingly is getting - ASU is doing more with less which is what I want to see in a coach.
Looked another way their defensive FEI was low 30s in 2012, low 20s in 2013 and is back at low 30s in 2014. I am increasingly looking at this rather than total offense and total defense because I think it adjusts better for differences in conferences. That is solid. Not elite but solid. This year his defense should have been a disaster - imagine UM starting Mone, Winovich, and Brandon Watson. That is the equivalent of 3 of his starters. Then throw 6 other new starters around them. . Then throw that defense into the Pac 12 where Air raid or pass spread offenses abound. Versus facing Minnesota, Northwestern, Penn State and other such sludge in the Midwest. We'd be bottom 5 in the country with that group if we did that with our team.
I dont know why he has the reputation of no defense - that is Sumlin. Graham is actually from a defensive background - he just hired great OCs before anyone knows about them - he hired Malzahn and Chad Morris at Tulsa and has a similar guy Norvell now at ASU. He was not going win with defense at Tulsa. Mark Dantonio didnt build any great defenses at Cincy - you just dont get that type of athlete at that level.
October 26th, 2014 at 3:37 PM ^
the offense knows what is coming. The defense has to read and react.
You can scheme on offense with less talent but with guys who play fundamentally sound football. But on defense, especially against spread chaos teams, you need guys who can just make plays. AKA, the guys who are going to the top schools. The big **** athletes.
You don't find too many of those guys at Tulsa, Houston or Cinci.
October 27th, 2014 at 12:21 AM ^
At ASU he had done it with a LOT of JUCOs. He couldn't do that at U of M, so that is a serious concern.
October 26th, 2014 at 12:28 PM ^
I live in Pittsburgh, and after he left lots of talk from the talking heads was of how Graham's wife just didn't "feel it" living in Pittsburgh. They're southerners, where 50 degress is cold. He's not coming to Michigan.
October 30th, 2014 at 12:55 PM ^
Wanted to get my list in...2 names not mentiond that are better than all the other 'flash in pan' listed candidates...
1. Obviously, John-then-Jim Harbaugh.
2 . Jon Gruden
3. Mike Singletary ( a great college coach waiting to happen)
4. Bill Cowher
5. Les Miles
Do you really want to win?
Get one of these!
October 30th, 2014 at 12:55 PM ^
Wanted to get my list in...2 names not mentiond that are better than all the other 'flash in pan' listed candidates...
1. Obviously, John-then-Jim Harbaugh.
2 . Jon Gruden
3. Mike Singletary ( a great college coach waiting to happen)
4. Bill Cowher
5. Les Miles
Do you really want to win?
Get one of these!
October 25th, 2014 at 9:58 PM ^
I commend OP on the ability to write and think coherently after this afternoon's events.
(I also suspect that this could have been written earlier with pretty good confidence that it would still be relevant postgame).
October 25th, 2014 at 10:53 PM ^
Nah I wrote if post game. Being a long time Lions fan I have the abilitity to process bad emotions quickly. I am also in the apathy stage with UM football - while it still hurts to lose I have come to expect it so while it "affects" me it is what it is at this point, I dont expect anything different and I had already made that determination post Notre Dame when I saw no change in the offense from 2013. And another middle of the pack defense.
So I've been hunting for a new coach since the 2nd week of the season.
October 25th, 2014 at 9:58 PM ^
would never come to Michigan, nor should Michigan want him. At this point we are better off going for a younger coach like Graham or even OSU OC Tom Herman.
October 25th, 2014 at 10:15 PM ^
I don't believe anyone is actually serious about Jim Tressel, but even if they were he has a show cause penalty until December of 2016.
October 25th, 2014 at 10:45 PM ^
He'd get the hall pass from the NCAA for good behavior or something equal.
As to those opposed to Tressel, obviously so tired from all these recent years of "winning the right way"
/smh
October 25th, 2014 at 11:09 PM ^
October 26th, 2014 at 12:05 AM ^
But I would try to get Bob Stoops first. Maybe he would like a new challenge since he's won everything at Oklahoma.
October 26th, 2014 at 10:17 AM ^
October 25th, 2014 at 11:59 PM ^
October 26th, 2014 at 12:35 AM ^
Narduzzi would be a far superior option to Hoke. The absolute worst outcome would be for Hoke to return as coach. The damage of a return next year would take years to recover from because of recruiting and loss of season ticket holders.
Narduzzi has consistently had one of the top defenses in the country and would most certainly instill the right attitude within the locker room.
October 26th, 2014 at 1:22 AM ^
There is no bringing Hoke back. You'd ruin 2 recruiting classes, not 1. That is something that would create a donut hole in various position groups in the late 2010s, early 2020s. You cannot send a lame duck coach out there to recruit for an entire year. Then you have the Shane incident over Hoke. Then you have the you are just a bad coach situation over Hoke.
I don't want Nuss anywhere near this program either. He is probably a solid coach that needs to be somewhere else.
2015 is not going to be good - Hoke walking around leadng this program is going to be... whatever adjective happens after you go past toxic. I know people are going to be drinking the maize Kool Aid because of "all the talent" but until Shane Morris transforms himself into something he is not today (with a sorta QB guru like Nuss who has not made him better) or Speight is some sort of revelation we are going to have a rough year. It could be another 5-6 win year. We lose our top 3 playmakers in Funchess, Jake Ryan, and Frank Clark. We dont have a single playmaking WR as we had with Gallon and Funchess the past 2 years. Our OL is still a work in progress - no guarantee it gets much better next year. The offense is going to be bad again and everyone will be pinnng hopes on yet another guy no one has seen - Ty Isaac - as the next great hope. We send a new QB into to play Utah to open the season, then we have to host BYU with the type of QB that has been terrorizing UM defenses for 2+ decades in game 4. Oregon State loses its star QB but is not a pushover. We will be 2-2 to start the year unless some miracle happens. And a 4-4 record in the Big 10 will be an achievement. I am not being reactionary - I dont see a lot of NFL talent on this team today, and a big chunk of it is going into the next draft. After they leave I see Lewis, Henry, and Butt as the remaining high end players. Peppers I guess if 1 game v Miami OH has told you he is a star.
Can you really see another year of trotting out "we had a great practice" and other such nonsense? We'd be the laughingstock of college football.
A first year coach will have the benefit of "oh well ....new systems, transition year" etc and be given a long leash in 2015. Hoke would get crucified the first time we fall behind.
October 26th, 2014 at 4:07 PM ^
October 26th, 2014 at 11:34 PM ^
If you think the atmosphere is toxic now, see what happens next year if Hoke comes back. I don't know what drugs you are taking, but please distribute them to everyone on this board. There is no way that the team is going to miraculously go 5-1 or 6-2 to start next year.
You must be hanging around in the AD and drinking the kool aid....
October 27th, 2014 at 12:24 AM ^
I think it is likely that Hoke returns if Brandon is the AD. Brandon strikes me as the kind of person who would keep Hoke, issues and all, just to spite the rest of us. Hoke could lose out by 40 each game and there is still a decent chance that Brandon keeps him around. It's why Brandon needs to go first and soon.
October 26th, 2014 at 12:12 AM ^
Why would M have a stipulaiton that the coach run a pro set offense? It's not exactly the rage that is sweeping the nation. I realize RR didn't have wonderful success here, but he was in the process of making Michigan schematically modern. I think I might have a stipulation that any non-Harbaugh candidate would be banned from running a pro style offense. I mean, every guy runs his stuff, RR, Shafer, GERG, 3-3-5, Tempo, grrrr, et al...but yeah. Let's not run a shi- pro set offense anymore as if it's the only thing M could run.
October 27th, 2014 at 11:23 AM ^
It's almost certain we'll get a guy who has an offense that runs spread elements, just due to the numbers. That's fine. But I don't want a guy who comes in and runs want doesn't make sense just because that's what he runs and that's "modern".
October 28th, 2014 at 12:28 AM ^
October 26th, 2014 at 1:20 AM ^
ASU rid the Wolverines of Bill Frieder and allowed the 1988-89 team to stop playing "tight" and win the NCAA Championship. It would be terrible to return the favor by taking a very good coach from them.
October 26th, 2014 at 2:27 AM ^
When you look across the landscape of college football, there's only 3-4 Power 5 conference teams of any significance running a pro style offense. Stanford, Arkansas, Alabama, Wisconsin & Pitt (if you call them significant). We have the talent on offense to hire a spread coach whose scheme doesn't revolve around the zone read primarily. Look at Utah's QB that torched us, Rutgers' qb, etc. Morris and Speight can do the same in a spread.
The thought that we need a pro style coach highlights the flaws within Michigan athletics that are the crux of our woes. The unwillingness to change, resting upon traditions, instead of building upon them.
For ex; the lack of a real college environment in the stadium. Why is this? Because season ticket prices are out of the range of younger fans that would change the atmosphere, and silver foxes are allowed to keep tickets for an eternity. We've all heard it, "I've had season tickets for 35 years". Thus, a crowd that scares no one.
Ex 2. The lack of frequency of night games and making every night game a spectacle. A large majority of programs across the country host so many night games that "Under The Lights" branding wouldn't even make sense. There's no need to brand night games. Host more than one per year. I know that would annoy grandma and grandpa who won't give up their seats, may have to stay up late, but we must evolve.
Ex.3 No Thursday or Friday night games. More institutional stubbornness. All of the top SEC teams play on these nights during the week. We should be doing it as well, in September & October. The uppity fan will say, we're to big for that blah blah blah. It would be awesome for the program.
I could go on & on. We have to get with the times overall. My coaching wish list is below.
Jim Harbaugh, Kevin Sumlin, Dan Mullen, Hugh Freeze, Bob Stoops, Chad Morris
Wild Card* Ed Orgeron
October 26th, 2014 at 4:38 AM ^
Night games are the solution? Are you Dave Brandon? You can make every game this season a night game and it wouldn't make a difference in the results.
October 26th, 2014 at 12:46 PM ^
Do you want a spread offense run by a QB like Denard/Pat White
or something closer to an air raid throw first spread?
October 27th, 2014 at 9:55 AM ^
Two scenarios that I think seem possible, not saying they will-
1>Nussmeier gets promoted.
2>Mark Stoops takes the job and hires an OC with full control to implement and direct the offensive side (Stitt???)
October 27th, 2014 at 3:54 PM ^
I bet Stoops has never heard of Stitt. Or if so only in passing.
Stitt is in a circle with Holgoerson, Sumlin, Morris, Graham, and those types.
October 29th, 2014 at 5:54 AM ^
1. Jim Harbaugh
2. John Harbaugh
3. Dan Mullen
4. Mark Stoops
...for me, the list ends there.
Miles vs. Dantonio would be a crazy entertaining matchup though. It would be like watching a kid try to trick himself in the mirror.
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