I recall a few good friends on the 88-92 teams who were on the OL and had Hanlon as their coach, and they were petrified of him.
Boren, Lost Linemen, and a Staff to be Proud of
I was asked to repost this from the MGoBoard. I added a few things (in Bold) so enjoy the read.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />
Having had breakfast with Coach Frey and "BIG" Dusty earlier in the year he wrapped up the Boren situation in a very easy way.
1. Boren wanted to go home whenever he need to help his dad with his snow plow business. He abused that excuse.
2. He had always wanted to go to Ohio State to be closer to home and his dad bribed him to go to Michigan, hoping he would grow to love it.
3. He wanted to do "his workout not Mike's"
4. He just simply "hated to run". Coach Frey jokingly told the linemen they had to run sprints at the end of practice before a holiday break (I think Easter Break). The intent was to have them line up and then surprise them with "I'm just kidding you don't have to run any sprints today". Instead of lining up Boren walked out of practice.
5. Even with all of that the staff wanted to make it work and get him on board...there is no doubt he is a talented player. After he left practice before the sprints Coach Frey confronted him about his actions. Even though he hated running he admitted that he was in the best shape of his life from Barwis "forcing" him to workout. Why the staff finally quit on him was when he talked about the new guys being "scrubs". By "new guys" I mean the current linemen not the new recruits.
If this is all true and I believe every word of it...then it really gives me a new level of respect for the way the staff handled it in the media...they could have trashed this kid but decided to concentrate on the players they were working with currently...can you imagine Lane Kiffen taking the high road like this?
Players like Boren are not good for a program no matter what culture it is...I'm glad the coaches now weed out these guys that would have coasted during the Carr years.
I'm not saying Wermers or O'niell is that guy but having talked to most of the staff and having watched a half dozen practices up close I will tell you this...Coach Frey is a really nice guy to sit and talk with socially, he will talk to you about anything in the papers about the program, he is straight forward and will give you "real answers". That being said he does not even begin to take one ounce of shit from his players. He teaches very aggressively and that’s just his style. I can see why guys who don't want to work or don't fit in want to leave on the offensive line. He is much more vocal and demanding then a guy like Coach Jackson...you could probably go four years without him ever taking your head off the way Coach Frey will.
In football no matter the level you have to build a foundation. Sometimes the best laid foundations come from subtracting materials instead of adding them. I truly believe Boren is a good player, I also believe that if we would of had a strong senior class last season he would have straightened out over time and been a strong player. Since we had little senior leadership a guy like Boren...or O'neill...or Wermers can become a cancer to young a team and effect them for years. That attitude must be wiped out from a team that is struggling. It’s hard enough to turnaround a struggling program without having to pull guys who don't want to go. Coach Rodriguez has said many times before that when you lose you have two options...New Players or New Coaches. I'm glad to see its the players that are going (besides Shafer) and not this staff. I really believe these are the guys to take UofM to the next level.
"Hold the Rope"
oh, and by the way, Boren's father Mike should have put a lid on his kid's mouth... it's disappointing.
All Michigan Men unite and hold that soap! It can get a bit slippery in the shower, and you can't hold it too tightly or it will shoot out like a booger from a sneeze.
Seriously, people, forget about Boren.
Yeah, I work with Corey Zirbel's GF and he comes in all the time and hangs out with us. He was his roommate their Freshman and Sophomore years and he said that Boren was very anti-social and was home every weekend during the off seasons. He also said that Boren's dad bought him a brand new boat for going to Michigan so there's the bribe part. It was interesting to see how little he cared about Boren leaving, being his roommate/ housemate and all.
yeah the boat was the bribe. At least thats what was said.
If points 1-5 contain even an ounce of truth, then Boren should feel damn lucky none of this was made public by the coaching staff. This was clearly an addition by subtraction and I can't wait to see Martin and Big Will bitch smack him this November!
Before he transferred, he was singled out by both Barwis and Rodriguez for being the hardest worker on the team thus far in Spring Practice. He likely transferred because he didn't like Rodriguez, or Michigan, and his family was upset his brother wasn't offered. Not because he couldn't hack it. If you think OSU has a cream-puff S&C program, you're fooling yourself.
So all these other players and his position coach are lying? Spring practice isn't off season conditioning...maybe they were trying to give him some encouragement. I think if anybody is being fooled, it's you.
The coaches themselves said he was their hardest worker.
Do you think that at Ohio State they sit around and have Mai Tai's all day? That's how they're kicking our ass? He left because his family was upset about his brother.
What I read was a direct quote from Barwis and Rodriguez, to Rivals. What you're reading is a wannabe insider on a message board.
Rivals...journalism at its best. You got me there!
Nobody said OSU S&C was easy, but do you know for a fact that they make lineman run a lot like Barwis?
Calling A_Maize_Zing a "wannabe insider"...not cool.
really? A wanna be insider?
I'm going to go cry all by myself now... I would suggest if thats how you view this, then to not read my post...I tend to type a lot and it seems like a lot of effort to read all of it for so little benefit to yourself.
Just a suggestion
1. In 142 posts, you've never once suggested that you have access to people.
2. You blow sunshine that people want to hear - that's why they believe you.
3. You blithely talk about how you had lunch breakfast with Frey without attempting to detail how you come by that access.
Color me skeptical.
I would just read my post...the answers are there. I don't have access to people on a regular basis.
How am I blowing sunshine? People who know the situation believe me because it reflects what they have already heard and it checks out. Again I was sharing what I was told, it made sense in the original post to bring this up. I didn't run back and say "HAY LOOK AT ME I TALKED TO A COACH AT MICHIGAN"...it really is not that big of a deal... I thought I would share some insight but stop acting like these guys are "Gods" and no one could get access. They are normal people and are actually like anyone else. Yes this came up at breakfast at Glazier Clinic in Mt. Pleasent. As well as talking about a charity golf event ran by one of the high school coaches and also how Frey lost 100 pounds on the Atkins diet after deciding he was too fat when someone called him to go party and he decided not to because he just ate a whole Pizza by himself and felt sick and tired... he's a nice normal guy who will talk to you about this shit in a social situation.
Also I have actually posted about being at Michigan and dealing with some of the coaches and support staff before so don't make a blanket statement like that without looking into it.
MgoObes stated that it had nothing to do with the younger Boren. So, there's that.
The Michigan coaches give Boren an outright release allowing him to go to OSU and he thanks them by setting the bridge ablaze as he leaves. That should be all anyone needs to know about the situation.
At no point did I say Boren wasn't an asshole. I'm saying he's not leaving because he was afraid of working. I guarantee you that OSU conditioning isn't "easy".
His brother never came up in the conversation.
1. Frey is a position coach who probalby would not have talked about this with Boren anyway.
2. Frey doesn't recruit the state of Ohio. So why even bring up your brother to him.
3. I could be wrong but we still could have offered his brother at the time he left in March. Fred Jackson took Zach around campus and wanted him to commit to Michigan as a fullback.
In the end I think Rich Rod decided to not offer after this qoute from Zach..before the process ended
“Yeah, I mean, a lot of the schools that are recruiting me just come in and ask my coach if it’s just Michigan or Ohio State. But right now, I’m actually leaning against Michigan. To tell you the truth, I think it would be cool, starting a different legacy with a Boren going to a different school, so I want to get out to as many schools as I can.”
Why offer to a guy who wants to start a new Boren tradition somewhere else.
Justin may have worked...but it seems like only after he went kicking and screaming...Also as far as fitting in with Ohio States conditioning program, I'm sure he will, that doesn't mean he likes it or wants to do it...considering he is not on scholarship he better work or his ass will be gone.
Thank you for posting this. Your story and accounts of what Coach Fry said, certainly seem spot-on and jive well with other accounts of Boren's actions at Michigan (aka the snowplow leave of absences, the charity car wash incident etc)....
I also agree with you completely on how the staff has handled this very professionally.
Better to weed out kids like this one who can be cancerous to a program....and start fresh with players that are willing to work hard to improve.
is how some Bucknut fans seem to feel that Boren is going to become some kind of all-american, 1st round draft choice. I think he will do well, but some of the expectations on him are really quite ridiculous.
I'm sorry, but I don't know who A_Maize_Zing is or how he this access. Any help for the uninformed?
I am a lowly high school football coach. I end up at a lot of Michigan events from clinics, games and practices. Most clinics end the same way just sitting around with coaches drinking beer and talking about the coaches program.
This is really pretty basic and not at all special or out of the ordinary. The last two years Michigan has become much more open (compared to the Carr years...no suprise). College coaches never eat alone at these events because they want to cultivate relationships. I've got to hear some great stories from Coach Frey and Coach Hopson and I figured I would share one.
I am not in anyway an "insider" like Tom VH.
Was one of these events the coaching clinic, and were you by chance one of the coaches at the end trying to finish all the beer while some of the student workers drank with you? If so, awesome!
I was at the the last clinic but I had to drive home so I kept myself under control. I drank with Hopson for a little while.
Keep this on the down low...he chews with his mouth open...bad.... now that is inside information.
Thanks. I was just wondering because it seemed as though you were a known entity to everyone except me.
I guess the phrase "everybody's equal, though some are more equal than others" applied to Boren under Lloyd. Sounds like it changed rather quickly when the new staff arrived.
A Maize Zing, I like what you wrote. The kid really never wanted to be here in the first place, from what you are saying.
Anyway, we've got about six weeks until we start finding out some answers
We will surprise in 2009.
i can't believe that you are believing the lies that frey is saying about boren now to cover his ass.
1. boren did go home on weekends but never missed a practice or meeting & so was a non issue with rr.
2. the comment that justin never wanted to go to um is laughable at best. his whole life he spent loving um & had known bo from a baby. his years with carr and moeller are 2 of the best years of his life. oh sure his dad had to bribe him to go to um. what kind of crap is that?
3. justin loved barwis and barwis loved justin and named him the workout room warrier the 2 weeks in a row before justin left um.
4. justin didn't hate to run.....he wasn't able to run long distances as he had whats called compartment syndrome & he was to have surgery on both his calves the spring rr took over. the coaches all knew about this. by the way he just had this surgery done at osu this year so hes able to run long distances now without cramping up.
ok now your story about frey joking about running sprints.....part of that is true and frey was always making the players stay after practice and after every other coach & player left & made the linemen runs sprints till they dropped.
well at that point and time of freys so called joke which by the way was not going to be a joke till justin left the practice field. and justin left at that point in time because he was at his breaking point with frey & rr
he quit the team right after this episode.
5. barwis had to force justin to work out frey says??? are you kidding me!!!! frey is such a big lier. justin has always loved to work out and i explained this in # 3.
bottom line what frey didn't say to a maize zing is that hes a sexual pervert & every day all day long in meetings all he wanted to talk about to the players was how he screwed a girl the night before that he would have picked up in a bar and go into great details. plus he always had to talk at length about how he was an all american in high school and had to ride the bench in college and how he got screwed over etc.
so believe what you want about boren and others. but in borens case he couldn't continue having frey & rr as his coaches and perform up to his expectations.
and don't tell me in the future how great rr & frey were to never trash boren. they sure as hell did thru others who they got to do their dirty work.
as for rr giving justin his transfer papers......another lie. rr wouldn't give justin his release and held it up and told justin he could hold it up for years. justins dad had to go to martin & threaten a law suit if he didn't give justin his relase.
its so sad how all this came about and so sad for the boren family who loved um & everything it used to stand for.
And...you need to shut up, too. I just wish people wouldn't feel the need to spout every drop of "INSIDAH!" information that pops into their heads.
Justin played with only one kidney after donating the other to a third world child in need. Coach Frey used to punch and throw things at his lone kidney as a "joke".
Justin volunteered as a big brother. Once, when he left the kid at Schembechler hall, Frey and RR had bought the kid hookers and blow.
Frey is a known Holocaust denier. His plan to have all of the lineman get swastika tatoos was foiled only by a surprise visit by former kicker Hayden Epstein (who was tipped off by Justin).
Justin is a gym rat who runs ultramarathons for fun on the weekends. Frey would mock him saying "I play real sports, not trying to be the best at exercising".
Justin loved Michigan and still does. That Halloween picture was not a costume. He sits around his apartment in Columbus dressed like that.
On recruiting trips through Ohio, Frey has been known to literally shit on the Boren's lawn.
Justin was actually Bo's love child. RR hated that he was a link to the old regime and ran him off the team with all his "pussy" talk and other potty language.
The truth squad has more. This is just the tip of the iceberg.
If I may be so rude to ask, how are you privy to such details? And why are you defending a kid who trashed our program? The rest of the guys who have been interviewed in the press(Schilling, Omameh, Ortmann)have only said positive things about the new staff.
And while I am not a legal expert, I believe your assertion that CoachRod held up his transfer papers is rubbish. The school would be facing dire consequences from the NCAA over an infraction like that. U of M would never allow such a thing to happen.
Are you a Buckeye fan trolling here?
believe what you want to believe.....
i just wanted to let you know the truth as i am privy to things unknown to you......peace & goodbye
Hey truth squad, the self proclaimed possessor of truth:
Many of us on this site are life long, die hard UM fans. If for some reason we had a falling out with the current staff, the last thing we would do is start rooting for OSU. The Borens had plenty of options other than OSU...so save the "loving" UM crap.
The family values angle is also bull. Boren has already made a name for himself with OSU teammates: "Oh my God, he's a crazy dude," Gibson said. "It's good to have him over there because we're lining up and he's screaming and cussing and [stuff]." Saint Justin, eh?
Last, more than just Frey disputed Justin's whining to the media when he left...but I guess they're all wrong since you "are privy to things unknown" to us common folk.
The thing I remember Mike Boren saying was that he wasn't going to have his boys go to different schools, which led me to believe that Zach's not being offered was the biggest problem the family had with Michigan.
thats just a lie that was offered up after justin left um. zach had nothing to do with justin going to osu either. when justin left um he was devestated as was his whole family who bled maize & blue.
he was being bombarded by coaches calling his high school coach and offering justin. and zach had already gotten his offer at this time from osu just not commited. so thats why mike made that comment. it was a stupid comment mike made at the time but he was so upset and wasn"t thinking straight. he meant it for teams like ucla and other far away teams that were offering justin & he wanted to watch both boys play and he couldn't if justin was too far away. at that time i think mike knew justin was going to go to osu as it was the only other team justin had considered when he made his choice and he did really like tressel.
Ok. You don't get it both ways. You don't "bleed maize and blue" and then go to OSU.
You might have an affinity for UM because dad played there. You might like coach Carr. You may think the new coach is an asshole and want to leave. That's all good. You might be angry over the situation and blow off steam on the way out. Classless, but human and forgivable.
You might be a pragmatist and say "The style that Tressel plays is a good fit. I'll have good exposure to play on the next level. I'll be on a winning team that is close to home". Once again that is fine. Pragmatism is ok. No problem looking out for number one.
But you don't "bleed maize and blue". It is a stupid saying and if you truly had that level of love for an institution but couldn't play for its coach, you would find another option to continue to ply your craft.
So truth squad, you may have access to some insider info and be sympathetic. But spare me your sob stories for "Justin" and "Mike" and the whole Boren clan. I don't give a shit.
This thread is disturbing on several levels.
1) I don't like the allegations about Frey.
2) Some of the truth squad assertions could be true; I don't know.
3) Some of the OP assertions can be true, again, not clear.
4) Some of the posters seem to be slamming others saying things they don't want to hear.
5) On this last, are we willing and ready to hear truth about Michigan, regardless of whether we like it or not? We're willing to trash little brother and OSU and Alabama and Louisville and Memphis. If and when our coaches and our team do something out of line, I hope we are big enough to criticize their bad actions. It doesn't help to be someone who can dish it out but not take it. That's called a bully.
Innuendo and slander are not good. I don't like it against RR, but I also don't like it against Boren & Tressel et al.
I also think that sometimes, when we make mistakes, and are embarassed, we're glad not to have our names dragged through the mud. I think Boren made some mistakes in what he said when he left. But let it go. I do think it likely that the Boren family loved Michigan, and threads like this seem intent on bashing Boren and burning bridges further. Who does this help?
Agreed - I have problem with both the OP and the "truthsquad" posts, though they're polar opposites. In general, I don't put much stock in people that eagerly logon to a website for the purposes of passing off "insider" knowledge anonymously - especially with the intention of knocking people. I don't care if it's RR, Frey, Boren, or Tressel. It's bullshit. The fact is that we had 2 people doing it here - one said things the crowd wanted to hear, and the other said things they didn't want to hear. One got positive votes, one didn't. IMO, they're both bullshit.
A kid didn't like the new coaching staff and left. I don't see the need to demonize either party. Both posts seem very self serving. Give it a rest.
Post 1: "Coaches are awesome! Boren's a pussy who hates workouts!"
Post 2: "Coaches are perverts! Boren's a Saint!"
They're equally credible (ie: not). The difference is that one caters to the crowd.
Doesn't anyone remember the story about Bo sitting at the kitchen table with Justin and Mike when Justin was trying to decide, and Bo turned to Mike and said, "You're not going to let him go to Ohio State are you?
That story has always stuck in my craw and lends credence to the statement that Justin never wanted to go to UM in the first place.
Hey guys, I'm an insider. Rich Rod has a 19" cock and Tate looks like he's going to win the Heisman! I know all this because I ate breakfast with Rita's hairspray technician. Now LOVE ME GOD DAMMIT.
Her look is all-natural