Ya, he did bring our averages down. Who cares though since we got a kicker!
that makes one of us
As usual, new commit means we hit the front page. Action since last rankings:
12-19-10 Iowa loses commitment from Mika'il McCall (false alarm from the recruiting sites).
12-20-10 Illinois gains commitments from Dondi Kirby and Kenny Nelson. Minnesota gains commitments from Grayson Levine and Marcus Jones. Nebraska loses commitment from Tevin Mitchell. Wisconsin gains commitment from Devin Gaulden.
12-22-10 Illinois loses commitment from Tyler Marcordes.
12-24 Michigan gains commitment from Matt Goudis. Minnesota gains commitment from Drayquan Crawford.
|Big Ten+ Recruiting Class Rankings|
|Rank||School||# Commits||Rivals Avg||Scout Avg||ESPN Avg|
Rivals rankings are on the "RR" scale, which is on a scale from about 5 to about 6.1. Unrated prospects are given a 5.1 rating, on par with the worst of any Big Ten commit last year. Scout is on the 5-star system (unranked players earn 1 star), and ESPN uses grades out of 100 (unranked is 40 or 45, except JuCo players, who aren't included in the average).
Full data after the jump.
|#1 Ohio State - 19 Commits|
|#2 Notre Dame - 19 Commits|
|George Atkinson III||S||CA||5.8||4||79|
No change for the Irish.
|#3 Nebraska - 18 Commits|
Tevin Mitchell drops Nebraska.
Wolverines pick up Cali kicker Matt Goudis. Now that they have about the same number of commits as Michigan State, and better averages all around, they pass MSU in the rankings.
|#5 Michigan State - 16 Commits|
No change for Sparty.
|#6 Wisconsin - 20 Commits|
Badgers pick up Devin Gaulden.
|#7 Iowa - 18 Commits|
Mika'il McCall didn't actually commit to the Hawkeyes last week, that was a false alarm for the premium recruiting sites.
|#8 Illinois - 24 Commits|
Illini continue their recent hot streak picking up Dondi Kirby and Kenny Nelson. Whitlow picks up a 2-star rating from Scout. Tyer Marcordes drops the Illini.
|#9 Indiana - 18 Commits|
Hoosiers lose OH S Nick VanHoose to Northwestern. CJ Robbins, who decommitted from Indiana a couple weeks ago, also picked the Wildcats.
|#9 Northwestern - 13 Commits|
Wildcats pick up a pair of Indiana decommits in OH DB Nick VanHoose and IL DE CJ Robbins.
|#10 Minnesota - 17 Commits|
Gophers pick up a couple low-rated guys.
|#12 Penn State - 8 Commits|
Matt Zanellato gets a 3-star rating from Scout.
|#13 Purdue - 12 Commits|
Carter and Shavers get 5.4 ratings from Rivals.
Ya, he did bring our averages down. Who cares though since we got a kicker!
Didn't you guys get a kicker last year and the year before? Or is Hagerup exclusively a punter?
as a punter, and will likely exclusively be a punter. There was some talk of him hitting some kick-offs in practice as the other guys were struggling to get the ball deep with any hang time. Hopefully Goudis remedies that. Brendan Gibbons was the FG/KO guy signed two years ago. Much ballyhooed out of high school in FLA. Redshirted. And then ... well as you might have guessed, things didn't go so well for any michigan place kicker this year outside of practice -- neither the scholarship kicker or the walkons.
I expect better out of you.
Talk is cheap. Forget talk about Hagerup in practice - he had 16 kickoffs in ACTUAL games this year, with the highest average amongst the kickers (60 ypko). And it's not a sample size issue, because he had just as many kickoffs as Gibbons did this year.
Alright, arguing kickers. Airspeed velocity?
Pooh pooh kickers and the special teams all you want. The special teams were a direct cause of at least two losses, and led to the floodgates opening in a third loss. Had the requisite detail been paid to special teams this year, we probably wouldn't see these letters
on every other thread on this message board.
Genuine question: Which games do you feel were lost (at least two IYO) because of poor special teams play?
My recollection of the losses:
MSU -- critical TO's (2 INTS in the end zone) and a horrible overthrow by Denard
Iowa -- TO's (-4 TO margin in a 10 pt loss)
PSU -- McGloin'd
Wisconsin -- Blown-out by much better team
OSU -- Blown-out by much better team
Remember the team's comeback against Iowa? Well, Michigan helped stop it in its tracks due to terrible kickoffs. From Brian's game recap:
Michigan kicks the ball out of bounds TWICE in the fourth quarter, giving the Hawkeyes the ball on their own 40-yard line. The Hawkeyes score on both ensuing drives (one touchdown, one field goal). IMPACT: argh.
Michigan lost by 10, recall. Special teams helped directly lead to the loss. Iowa's average starting position was its 34. That's easy.
Second, Penn State. After they scored to go up 21-10, Gallon steps out of bounds at the 2. Michigan has a 20-second drive, then McGloin gets the arm punt TD at the end of the half. Back = broken.
But if you felt the back didn't hurt that bad, it was truly split in half when Fitzgerald had the late hit in the 4th quarter. Penn State turned that drive into 3 points.
Ten points, or, the margin of victory again.
Finally, if Michigan had lost the Illinois game, it would have been because Illinois wasn't forced to go on a scoring drive starting any worse than their own 40 all day long.
Seriously, go look at the box score. Illinois, on every scoring drive, started at their own 40 or better.
Fix the special teams and Michigan would have been 9-3 this past year. I'm convinced of it.
were not good this year, and certainly would have helped a lot if they were just average. Few would argue with you there. But I don't necessarily think that's a reflection of "didn't pay requisite attention" to them. It's a stretch for me to think the coaching staff hit some other facet of the game at the expense Special Teams. Reports seem to indicated that FG kicking was actually pretty good on practice field, for example. I don't think there's much you can do as a coach other than run the things in practice that have been successful in the past, and RR's special teams historically have been pretty good. Sometimes it just comes down to kids executing on the field. Manyof the special teamers -- returners, kickers, coverage guys -- were pretty young this year (or walk ons like Broekhuizen). The overall lack of depth on the team dictacted a lot of this, I suspect (not being able to put Stonum back for many returns, for example). It's curious to me that we understand and are relatively forgiving of the young guys (or walkons) on offense and defense who make mistakes. Few would chalk it up to not paying enough attention to detail on the coaches part. I don't why it would be different for special teams.
There are over 100 players on the Michigan team, at least 80 were on scholarship. Enough with the lack of depth argument. That might have been valid in 2008, but for it to be an issue in the third year of a coach's program reflects on only one guy.
Further, the special teams coordinator is Tony Gibson, the same Tony Gibson who screwed up Michigan's defensive back recruiting in the 2010 cycle (Dorsey over Parker, Grimes or Knight? Good call), and the same Tony Gibson who seems mighty repellent to quite a few of the defensive backs who have passed through Ann Arbor since 2008 (really, isn't it amazing the number of cornerbacks who have gone off the rails since Gibson has shown up?). He became the ST coordinator in 2010, and the unit turns into the worst group of kickoff and return specialists I've ever seen. Gallon can't catch punts (who do you think made the call to keep sending Gallon back there instead of Dileo?), Gibbons can't kick, the return teams can't keep opposing teams inside their own 35. Further, the best player on his special teams gets suspended for the most important game of the year (a true cutting off the nose to spite the face situation). Effect of that? An 18-yard punt which led to OSU's first TD, and a craptastic kickoff which led to a return TD.
What is most annoying, however, is that the special teams are treated as an afterthought while the coaching staff has 3 guys on gameday that do nothing but pay attention to the QB position. One of RR, Magee or Smith is undoubtedly expendable at this point, because if Michigan doesn't fix its special teams, even if the defense improves in 2011, there is no way this team will compete for the conference title.
"Dorsey over Parker, Grimes or Knight?" is absolutely inaccurate. They wanted Sean Parker, he just chose to stay close to home at the end of the day. They didn't choose anyone over him. Same story with Rashad Knight and Rutgers.
You could make an argument that maaaaaybe Grimes was pushed out of the way in favor of Dorsey, but uh, dude: he was kicked out of school after one semester. It's not like he's a freshman All-American for Ole Miss. Not to mention Calvin Magee, not Tony Gibson, was the lead recruiter for Dorsey.
If you want to just make stuff up to support your argument, feel free. That doesn't mean it has basis in fact.
I guess the relative struggles of all three kicking off blended together in my mind.
I can only imagine where we'd be if we had an offseason under RR without any coaching change question or other nonsense. I guess it looks like we'll never know
s. How's this crop compare to years past? I'm assuming it'll be the best class RR has put together. Comparisons to Carr's last 5 or so years?
Well there's no way to know how good this class actually is. If you want to go by a services' ranking system, here's a link for Rivals which has a tab for the current class back to 2002's class.
I think this class obviously had more potential had RR's status been known, but given the circumstances, a nice class in my opinion, especially with the likely additions of Zettel and Frost.
Look at those LB's! Very nice...Here's hoping for Tabb, Frost, Lucien, and a couple of DT's to finish it off. Thanks Tim as always. Great month.
DB's too! Think about our secondary 2-3 years from now...experienced athletes that have been starting 2 years already and we'll have several solid athletes behind them! Things will get better on defense!!!! When that happens....look out!
Charlotte (NC) Mallard Creek QB Marquise Williams sticking with Tar Heels. "I WILL BE ATTENDING THE UNIVERSITY OF NORTH CAROLINA !"
Yes, only a Punter. But Goudis would be equal to ND's Brindza in the ratings if he had 2 more ESPN points.
Goudis is a kicker, not a punter. Please don't take Michigan's lead and exhibit such negligence about the special teamers playing for the Wolverines.
Brindza does both; like his 45 yard FG from this past season which was ruled no good by the refs because it went over the uprights instead of through them
don't count on that being a miss next year
What? It's not like they aren't recruiting kids to kick the ball through the uprights. "Negligence" wasn't the issue.
Recruiting kids, and properly developing them, are two distinctly different things.
They certainly aren't negligent regarding the former, but I'd say their lack of any specialized coaching wrt special teams is in fact negligence.
I don't want to break out the relevant comparison, but wait - yes I will. Guess which 11-1 team in a BCS game has a special teams coach, and guess which team had a top 15 special teams ranking this year?
So one team has a special teams coach and good special teams, and that means Michigan is negligent for not having such a coach? 100+ teams don't have any dedicated coaches for special teams.
Come on, dude.
It's astounding that Michigan could be so blind to the necessity of having a dedicated ST coach who isn't distracted by having other coaching duties.
Two other schools whose special teams coaches are distracted with other coaching responsibilities are Oregon and Auburn. Obviously, that has been a huge problem for them. Amazingly enough, I just checked Ohio State's official football website, and it doesn't even list "special teams" as a responsibility for any of their coaching staff. That has to be a big part of their terrible season this year.
But most surprising is the fact that the program that has had by far the best ST performance over the last 10 years or so, Virginia Tech, also does not list any coach with special teams responsibility. Beamer himself is directly involved, according to many articles written over the years, but there is no reference to his ST work on the Va Tech football website.
Nobody should assert that the ST performance by UM over the course of the RR era has been remotely good overall, but to attribute it to a lack of a dedicated ST coach who doesn't do anything else is an oversimplification that ignores factual reality.
I remember their last dedicated special teams coach. Do you? Jim Boccher was an unmitigated disaster.
Meant to reply to that guy down there who asked if Hagerup was a K/P.
Any news on Zettel yet or any other DL recruits.
Given what RR has had to deal with this is a strong class, and could get stronger yet
rivals ignoring the fact that goudis is now a michigan commit??? they still have him listed has a "solid verbal" with BSU...
Holiday weekend yo.
Is it unusual for Penn State to only have 8 commits at this point? What's going on there? They've been way behind for a while now, I expected a flood of recruits to have committed by now; goes to show you, I know damn near nothing about recruiting.
Getting a kicker is huge! RR has had so much drama surrounding him since the _hio State loss and he is still getting these kids to come here. D Hart is only a commit if RR is here! RR has to stay at least one more year....
I'm sure glad dat ritchie-rod's gettin' me sum good meat for my inaugrial season. Lloyd and Dave said Ron's coming over to coach the D and he likes cheeseburgers too.
Ronnie's misunderstood and he's a great coach. I likes Mikey De-bored too. He could be the OC! Lloys's good buddies with Mikey, and he likes cheeseburgers like me
Isn't this is B1G Ten recruiting ? Didn't ND give the B1G Ten "the finger" when asked to join ? Who gives a shit about ND ?
Sorry for the redundant questions ! ND sucks !!
Go Blue !