And we had at least one guy leave because of harsh criticism in practices...imagine having a national TV audience witness your de-maning.
Video Of All Varieties: Western
Otherwise Bobby Knight would've never made it past 40 as a coach.
There's always going to be someone who love it. Whether it be the kid or the kids dad.
With that said, I don't think it's useful like Rich Rod, his staff and Kelly and his staff do it. You can yell and scream, but a part of leadership is getting the best out of EVERY player and staff memeber. And yelling isn't a motivational tool for EVERY one.
It would be nice if calmly and clearly explaining what went wrong and why it went wrong worked for everybody. it doesn't. Neither does telling the player that they did a good job and that they'll get it back.
Kelly, by any measure, seems like a smart coach. I'm sure he realizes that he's a yeller. He's probably got a few assistants or GAs on staff that are the go-to nice guy confidence builders.
I mean, didn't we just hear that about Brady Hoke? Hoke was the player's favorite assistant coach because they went to him when they were feeling down. There are guys that do that well, and there are guys that are extremely effective at the invective. Being nice will ensure that the players like you. I'm not sure if it has anything to do with actually winning football games.
it's still uncalled for.
Should everyone get a ribbon, cookie, and orange juice too? Maybe a big group hug?
If so, do you consider that acceptable behavior?
Nice strawman argument. Perhaps you should consider the difference between the workplace and sports. They aren't exactly comparable experiences. Also, try to comment without swearing.
And I don't get why sports are different than any other job. If anything, it's worse in college football because you're dealing with 18-21 year old kids.
When you swear, it makes you look limited. Also, it is a bit funny that you don't like a coach yelling, but as soon as someone disagrees with you, you drop the f-bomb.
I don't know of any job that creates the kind of emotion and stress that sports does. Especially when you are talking about a sport like football. I don't think it is that odd that a coach would express that through yelling. Maybe in your land of sunshine and rainbows it is possible though.
I'm an attorney, which isn't exactly the lowest stress job in the world. We had a guy who frequently looked like Brian Kelly does in those clips, and attrition in that group was like 5 times higher than any other group. Pretty much everyone in the office agreed it was completely unacceptable.
And what Kelly is doing there isn't mere yelling. Lloyd yelled at guys. That's losing your mind on a sophomore in college (and the issue isn't the swearing, it's the "if it were legal I would totally be punching you in the face right now" vibe of the whole thing). I think that's completely beyond the pale. Agree to disagree, I guess.
I had a a--hole parter when I was a first-year associate yell at me (with cursing) because I flew back from my grandfather's funeral on a Monday instead of coming back on a Sunday night to be at work early Monday morning. It was probably one of the most stressful practice groups in any type of practice group there is and it was more or less acceptable. I hated it - thought it was obnoxiously stupid - but the practice group had a great working relationship. We worked hard and played hard. But everyone is different. Some of my friends couldn't take the heat and left. Others are still there as partners, making a sh-tload of money. To each their own.
when they fail an exam. Works wonders.
they're different because in one, you actually need intensity, and aggression, and (sometimes) anger to be successful. obviously. to suggest that screaming in someone's face falls outside the bounds of normal behavior on a football field is silly and purposely obtuse.
Yelling is part of football. Coaches screaming profanities and name-calling isn't. Hitting (hard) is part of football. Punching in the face is not. It's a matter of degree - the choice isn't between Brian Kelly and Mother Theresa.
Mother Theresa, hands down
Does your boss freak the fuck out on you?
youre talking about intercollegiate athletics, youre talking about somebody getting paid
Nice strawman argument. The choices aren't (a) scream and belittle and drop F-bombs or (b) hug player and give him a cookie. There is nothing wrong with screaming and getting in a player's face as a motivational tactic, but Kelly seemed out of control.
Pete Carroll had a steadfast role against demeaning criticism by his coaching staff in practices and games. He wanted his teams to bust ass in practices but, have fun,and it helped in recruiting too. His teams were tough, and obviously, very good. Purely anecdotal but, between my junior and senior year in high school we had a head coaching change. We went from a more cerebral, but tough coach to a coach who was right out of "meathead coach casting 101". Very foul mouthed and harshly critical. The team went from 8-1 to 1-8 although the talent wasn't appreciably worse.The coach was gone in two years. I wouldn't argue that it was solely because the coach was a jerk it contributed to it. Players didn't enjoy playing as much as they had. Participation continually dropped. Really, I believe you can be highly successful as a coach either way, but especially today, I think the notion that harsh criticism, let alone national humiliation, is necessary or preferable in making better players. Tougher players, has never been more wrong.
The problem with screaming and yelling is that you better back it up with wins and some legitimate accomplishments. Knight won (more than anyone in history), and so people put up with it. Also, the sensibilities of college athletes has changed in the past couple of decades, and the old style of belittling players in practice and public has definitely lost some of its effectiveness. This is especially true at a school like ND where most (if not all) of the recruited kids were the best players on their teams from the time they played pop warner. I think it is a social change as much as change is philosophy, but kids today are not going to default to "taking it" from a foul-mouthed coach at every turn. At some point, kids are going to tune out a coach who hasn't really won anything yet and who blames them for every bad thing that happens.
You see it in the professional leagues where screamers/"old school" coaches like Herm Edwards and Scott Skiles struggled to connect with guys making millions of more dollars than them per year, and I think you are seeing it a bit in college. If you win kids will listen, but if you aren't then kids with designs on being paid millions are not as inclined to listen to you bad-mouth them. That sense of subservience/loyalty to the name on the front of the jersey isn't always strong enough to make everyone listen.
I like that Bob held kids accountable for important things like best effort academically. I do NOT like the abuse he heaped on kids during games. I wouldn't want anyone to scream at my kid for cutting the wrong way on a play and if he laid hands on my son, I'd want to destroy him.
In short, be tough with kids when the issue is important, but the overall goal should always be to teach, not berate and belittle.
Thought you guys would appreciate the sarcastic fan-generated questions for Kelly over SI:
Some real zingers so far!
Do you think Crist is playing poorly because he suffered permanent brain damage after you let him return to play despite suffering a concussion during your loss to Michigan last year?
That's a burn.
And we had at least one guy leave because of harsh criticism in practices ...
Who was that? Somebody left the Michigan football program because of harsh crticism in practices? I've no doubt that in 130+ years of football, there may be a number of examples. I just can't think of anybody in the last several years.
It's almost hypnotic, I never get tired of watching it...
Walk on? I would say head on, run over.
It's so beautiful, but I still can't help thinking every time I see it, "man, Roh's ACL just dodged a bullet."
Same. Thank goodness.
Good eye. I looked at that dozens of times and missed that. Inches from pain.
They replayed this loop on the video boards like 5x, each time the entire stadium let out a bit "OOH"
Is a perfect example of how much has changed since mattison has taken over the defense. Ive been watching the packers do that LB stunt thingy for the last two years. On this play herron lines up inside, kovacs is outside. Herron runs wide and draws the tackle, kovacs cuts inside for the kill shot. I can not recall one single time in the last 3 years we did anything close to that.
Take a look at the pre-snap read. Michigan shows 7 at the line, 4 in coverage. Carder looks left, but has guessed wrong - two of the 7 to his left have dropped into coverage, while the rush is coming from the right. Michigan only sends four, but Kovacs gets a free release because of the blitz look.
Compare with the play where Kovacs got the tipped pass. Same pre-snap look - 7 at the line, and rush 4. But Carder guesses wrong again - Kovacs drops into the flat to his right this time, and his out read is now covered.
And Martin dropping into coverage. Awesome.
They looked prepared and executed the plan.
Check out this M v. WMU game description from Bleacher Report (sorry for the funky stat-formatting):
Man what a game well in the first half anyway. Here are the final stats for the game between Michigan and Western Michigan. WMU Vs Mich for stats
FIRST DOWNS................... 15 24
Rushing..................... 2 13
Passing..................... 11 11
Penalty..................... 2 0
NET YARDS RUSHING............. 38 242
Rushing Attempts............ 24 50
Average Per Rush............ 1.6 4.8
Rushing Touchdowns.......... 0 1
Yards Gained Rushing........ 70 257
Yards Lost Rushing.......... 32 15
NET YARDS PASSING............. 263 197
Completions-Attempts-Int.... 23-39-2 15-28-1
Average Per Attempt......... 6.7 7.0
Average Per Completion...... 11.4 13.1
Passing Touchdowns.......... 1 3
TOTAL OFFENSE YARDS........... 301 439
Total offense plays......... 63 78
Average Gain Per Play....... 4.8 5.6
Fumbles: Number-Lost.......... 2-1 1-0
Penalties: Number-Yards....... 3-15 8-72
PUNTS-YARDS................... 6-239 5-236
Average Yards Per Punt...... 39.8 47.2
Net Yards Per Punt.......... 37.2 42.0
Inside 20................... 2 1
50+ Yards................... 0 1
Touchbacks.................. 0 1
Fair catch.................. 4 1
KICKOFFS-YARDS................ 2-128 6-399
Average Yards Per Kickoff... 64.0 66.5
Net Yards Per Kickoff....... 43.5 44.7
Touchbacks.................. 0 1
Punt returns: Number-Yards-TD. 2-6-0 2-16-0
Average Per Return.......... 3.0 8.0
Kickoff returns: Number-Yds-TD 5-111-0 2-41-0
Average Per Return.......... 22.2 20.5
Interceptions: Number-Yds-TD.. 1-3-0 2-14-0
Fumble Returns: Number-Yds-TD. 0-0-0 0-0-0
Miscellaneous Yards........... 0 0
Possession Time............... 25:40 34:20
First Quarter................. 7:04 7:56
Second Quarter................. 6:36 8:24
Third Quarter................. 8:04 6:56
Fourth Quarter................. 3:56 11:04
Third-Down Conversions........ 5 of 14 6 of 16
Fourth-Down Conversions....... 0 of 1 2 of 3
Red-Zone Scores-Chances....... 0-2 1-3
Sacks By: Number-Yards........ 0-0 2-12
PAT Kicks..................... 1-1 4-4
Field Goals................... 0-1 1-1
[Michigan] completed 13-20 for 179 yds and 3 TDs—not bad for his first collegate start. I have to say of all the Qbs he looked the best he was confident, very poised, executed the offense very well and the most important NO TURNOVERS. He showed me he is more than ready to be our starter for the next 3-4 yrs.
Wr Junior Hemingway had 5 rec,103 yds, and 2 TDs...
The defense played VERY well in the first half only allowing 29 yrds. But gave up more than 200 + in the second half but I think the coaches were playing around in the second half. After all we had a 31-0 lead.
So I was, however, concerned in the second half with the lack of execution from the offense. That is a reason to be concerned but i think again the coaches were playing around again. But who knows!
So I hope you all had fun as I very well did and the important thing is the W. So see ya next week and hopefully it will come out another W against ND. 3:30 pm on ABC.
Date: September 5, 2009
dozens of views! Thanks for the GIF.
He's one guy I'll be paying attention to next week. Also Toussaint.
I love that his right shoulder pad is flapping. I love the desperation that yields a hint of recklessness as he reaches for his quarry. It wasn't a tackle. It was a guy breaking the waves to spell his screaming lungs. Awesome.
The true beauty of this play for me is that Kovacs executes a textbook
1) Head on the ball side of the body
2) Shoulder impacts the center of mass
3) Arms wrap up the ball carrier
4) Legs drive through the target
It's so infuriating when a player has a tackle lined up and decides to
"blow this guy up, brah!" thereby leaving their feet to deliver the BIG
HIT. This usually results in missing a moving target, and the lack of a
wrap-up usually results in the target bouncing off the defender's shoulder
pads and continuing on its merry way.
After the team's poor display of fundamental bloacking and tackling the
last few years, this Kovacs play is a refreshing display of fundamentals.
I loved Hoke's sideline presensce. My favorite moment was when they showed him explaining technique or whatever to two guys (William Campbell was one). No screaming, no profranity, just calmly TEACHING these kids. I was very impressed after seeing what Kelly was doing. I feel the last shreds of my resistance to the hire dissolving away.
I turned to my brother as he was out on the field teaching technique. I do believe we have a coach for whom kids are to run through walls.
Someone should anonymously send those to the parents of every kid ND is recruiting. Seriously, the guy looks like he should be committed.
i know the D isn't what we're hoping for (yet) but ohmygosh the tackling was so much better. There may have been open receivers for western, but when we went in for the tackle, they got tackled. so beautiful to see
The tackling was very good, the best in a long time.
The touchdown run at 5:02 in the first highlight video has a great block by Hemingway. I was so stoked for that.
Both the offense and defense will get BETTER as the year go along. Something new and something that is more than welcome.
The DB's were soft at first but as the game went on they began to press the Western recievers at the line and we did just fine. Took away those dinks that led to the first WM touchdown. Another fav was when Kovacs faked the blitz and fell into coverage and slapped away the pass. Earlier in the game Carder threw some nice passes into the blitz to get decent yards. Wonder if that was Kovacs or a coaches call.
Loved that play. I would have liked to see hit head come back to the quarterback a little earlier, he probably could have picked that off.
Pretty good, methinks. Not sure if it would even matter, if he were in track shorts and shoes, or full pads.