Three And Out Takes: Carr, Rodriguez, Martin Comment Count

Brian

imageSo. It's out.

I'm impressed with the large numbers of people who seem to have already blazed their way through Three and Out. It took me a while. I stopped for a few days after "Honeymoon from Hell" because it was too depressing; every chapter featuring a game I knew they'd lose spectacularly required a little bit of willpower to start.

But I'm done and a large number of you are done. It is time to talk the turkey.

We've got this document. What does it say about major players in the saga? I was planning one part here but this got long, so today we'll cover Carr, Rodriguez, and Bill Martin, with various players with less prominent roles in the story covered in a post tomorrow.

Lloyd Carr

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It says a few things about Lloyd Carr that are not nice, and implies more. Bacon's said he left a lot of things out that he could not get multiple sources on, which is both his responsibility as an actual journalist and horribly frustrating.

The main strikes:

  1. Informing his former players he would sign any transfer papers they wanted at his meeting with them after their bowl game, a marked contrast from the Bo-Bump transition.
  2. Telling Mallett he "needed to leave".
  3. Having zero control over his former players, or—worse—tacitly endorsing their behavior by not jumping down their throats.
  4. Offering something short of the fiery defense Bo would have launched once the program started taking fire.

That's aside from the state of the roster when Rodriguez took over, which wasn't specifically directed at the new man.

Those seem like major strikes. Screw it: those are major strikes, particularly #3. I find it inconceivable that Eric Mayes would made it thirty seconds into the embarrassing "we own this program" speech before Bo burst from his chest like a Xenomorph. Carr does nothing. Multiple former players trash Rodriguez in public. Carr does nothing. The 2009 golf outing that even guys like Chris Balas* come back from disgusted at, naming specific names of players (Marlin Jackson, Dhani Jones) who embarrassed themselves with their behavior. Is Carr even at it? It's worse if he is.

So, like, whatever. Carr doesn't owe anyone anything except the 400k a year he was pulling down as associate AD. But he's no program patriarch. He's just a guy who used to coach here. His loyalty is to an incredibly specific version of Michigan only. The difference between the Bo guys and the Carr guys is obvious. Bo guys organize a weird counterproductive rally for RR; Carr guys go on MNF and state they're from "Lloyd Carr's Michigan" or storm the AD's office to demand RR's firing after every loss**. There are exceptions, obviously. The trend is clear.

I have no sympathy for arguments the guy is being painted unfairly when he was offered the opportunity to tell his side a dozen times. If history is written by the losers here it's because the winners don't care what the public thinks. They can't be surprised when the public thinks they're not Bo.

Carr did a lot of things for the program but his legacy is significantly tarnished by the pit it found itself in immediately after his departure. It was his lack of a coaching tree, lack of serious coordinators, and lack of tolerance for Les Miles that caused Michigan to hire Rodriguez in the first place. It was his lack of a roster—seven scholarship OL!—and lack of support that provided Rodriguez with two strikes before he even coached a game. We can argue about how much is Carr's fault and how much is Rodriguez's, but figuring out the latter is pointless since RR is gone and everyone hates him. The former is "far too much."

*[By this I mean guys who work for publications for whom access is lifeblood. They're naturally more circumspect. The reaction on premium sites to this golf outing was unprecedented, with people moved to call actual former players out by name after years of dark mutterings.]

**[Not in the book; something I got from a good source.]

Rich Rodriguez

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via AnnArbor.com

If you left a goat in the locker room after a Michigan loss and then locked Rodriguez in it for five minutes, you would return to find the walls smeared with blood and feta. There would be no trace of the goat.

Rich Rodriguez was obviously not a stoic guy. His sideline tantrums proved that. The extent of his leg-gashing, table-throwing, goat-cheese-making post-loss hissies is probably the thing that Rodriguez is pissed about. They don't make him look like a stable dude. Neither does his descent into J. Edgar Hoover-esque paranoia, no matter how intent the university was on making that paranoia seems reasonable.

By the time I got through it, my reaction to Rodriguez's portrayal was different than that of the media reviewing the book. It doesn't paint Rodriguez as a guy I would want in charge of my football program. I can deal with one goat-annihilating postgame tantrum a year. Rodriguez seemed to have one after every loss.

So why do most neutral accounts play up the Rodriguez sympathy angle? They do not take the truth that the local media is dominated by agenda-laden twits to be self-evident. When Mike Rosenberg—who comes off as a real winner—bombed Rodriguez with a bunch of half-truths and misrepresentations I bombed back, stating that it was obvious the buyout kerfuffle was university-directed. Surprise: it was university-directed as they tried to get out of their 2.5 million dollar hook. Similarly, Free Press Jihad is re-exposed as a bunch of half-truths at best run by a couple of guys who "had countable hours in there at some point" but had it edited out, no doubt because that's not at all important in a discussion about whether Michigan was more than doubling their allotted time on Sundays.

If you go into the book knowing Rosenberg and Snyder published an embarrassing hack-job and that a large part of the media firestorm surrounding Rodriguez was a combination of University incompetence and the tiny lizard brains of certain folk in the local media*, the main takeaway from the book in re: RR is the sheer height of the plumes his emotional volcano shoots up. I mean, Bacon spends pages and pages on Rodriguez playing up the traditions of Michigan to his players. That's an obvious reaction to the Michigan Man business. I assumed Rodriguez was not an idiot when it came to firing up his troops, I guess, and that stuff shot by me. Beating a bleating ungulate against the wall of the Notre Dame locker room until it bursts into a kaleidoscope of viscera… that stays with you.

I feel bad for the guy. I'm glad he's gone.

*[The rest a combo of Rodriguez never winning any games and his remarkable ability to stick his leg into the press conference bear trap.]

Bill Martin

University of Michigan Athletic Director Bill Martin watches over Thursday afternoon, August 20th's football practice at the Michigan practice facility outside of Schembechler Hall. 
Lon Horwedel | Ann Arbor.com

Good Lord, man. I find it hard to believe that a guy who dragged Michigan kicking and screaming into massive financial success and smoothly hired John Beilein (admittedly after making a questionable hire in Tommy Amaker) was really as incompetent as… uh… I believed he was after the sailboat incident. That's Yogi Berra right there but it's also true.

Here's the the story of the post-Carr coaching search from the perspective of this site:

  1. Kirk Ferentz is reached out to and either is or is not offered; if offered he may have been given an offer that was a paycut. Ferentz fades but it seems like there was truth to the rumors.
  2. Flailing. Miles heavily discussed. ESPN reports Michigan contacts him after Ferentz falls through. They agree to wait until the SEC championship game is over. LSU boards buzz that Les has told his team he's out. I would be "surprised if it was not" Miles.
  3. Infamous ESPN report.
  4. Sailboat. "Have a great day." Sailboat.
  5. Conclusion reached in the aftermath is that M "essentially passed on Miles."
  6. Tedford and Schiano now start getting thrown around along with odder names like Grobe and Pinkel. Also some guy named Hoke. So much Hoke.
  7. Kirk Ferentz momentarily back. Then gone.
  8. Schiano talked to, offered, accepts, changes mind, offered again, says no.
  9. Sean Payton!
  10. Miles again! Seriously!
  11. Miles out again.
  12. Jim Grobe. Jim Grobe does not get an exclamation point.
  13. KC Keeler! Lane Kiffin! Seriously!
  14. Rodriguez out of nowhere.
  15. Sigh… Peanut Butter Jelly Time.

It seemed like a clown show, and behind the scenes… clown show. Martin wants Dungy, has no idea if Dungy—who is a broadcaster and can be contacted by anyone at any time for any reason—will take the job. Wants Ferentz, has no idea that the president of the university will stab him if he hires Ferentz. Wants Miles, has no idea that Lloyd Carr will stab him if he hires Miles. Somehow misses on Schiano, then has Rodriguez fall into his lap and grabs him before anyone can think about it, which sets up the whole buyout fiasco the media will spin for six months. The sailboat incident is even worse since Bacon asserts one of the main problems was Martin had a new cell phone and didn't know how to use it.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh /dies

Martin himself drops out of the story shortly thereafter, which is another indictment of the guy because what enters is a vast institutional incompetence that starts the Rodriguez media cockroach katamari rolling. Everything from the buyout to the Dorsey situation is mishandled not only by Rodriguez (sometimes not even by Rodriguez, as with the buyout) but by the people who should be telling him what is and is not possible. When Rodriguez went to bat for Dorsey with a guy in admissions the guy in admissions should have looked at the guy's transcript before saying yes, and then when he did look at the transcript he should have said no.

Instead we actually sign the guy—opening us up to the most cynical and loathsome of all the lizard-brain media attacks—only to find out he is nowhere near eligible. And don't get me started on the CARA forms, which was a special brand of idiocy all on its own. Martin did a lot of big picture stuff very well, but he was totally unprepared to fix a department that had started downhill long before he arrived.

For all the crap I give Brandon about his failure on big picture stuff, he cleaned out the deadwood with alacrity.

TOMORROW: Players, reporters, me/us(!?).

Comments

BRCE

October 26th, 2011 at 3:29 PM ^

In a word: weak.

Interesting how it was CARR's former players who did almost all of the talking, not Bo's players. That's ... not a coincidence.

The most damning argument against your points is the Bacon report that Carr is the one who gave RR a recruiting phone call and then, almost immediately after the hiring, started showing signs of no confidence. So did he see things in Rich he didn't before over those six days or did he just reach out to him to satisfy one of the top two priorities in his agenda (that Les Miles wouldn't be the hire)?

It's a highly political chain of events, people can see it, and that's why so many people don't trust Lloyd.

michgoblue

October 26th, 2011 at 3:40 PM ^

1.  "Interesting how it was CARR's former players who did almost all of the talking, not Bo's players. That's ... not a coincidence."

No, it is not.  It is, however, because Carr's former players are in their 20s, several of whom have a public forum by virtue of being in or around professional football.  By contrast, Bo's former players are, at their earliest, in their 40s (so perhaps a bit more mature), and almost exclusively no longer playing or commenting on football.

Also, many of Bo's former players, including several whom I have spoken to at various alumni events, have open admitted to being ecstatic that RR was fired.  So, maybe LC's players were a bit younger and therefore less mature, but their view was pretty universally shared by Bo's players.

2.  "Carr is the one who gave RR a recruiting phone call and then, almost immediately after the hiring, started showing signs of no confidence."

I think that the answer to this question is that, yes, LC reached out to RR to satisfy his primary goal of preventing the program from falling into the hands of a scum like Miles.  And thankfully he did.  Sure, we lost the last few years (and we would have won with Les), but at least RR is not not a scum.  Say what you will - a bad coach, a bad manager, a whacko, a nsake oil salesman (not endorsing any of these comments, by the way) - but he is not a scum like Miles.  So, if LC reached out to RR, sight unseen, to avoid Miles, then we all owe him a thanks.

As to supporting RR, perhaps RR didn't endear himself to RR by firing EVERY SINGLE ONE of the current assistants - people who could have helped ease the transition - when he came in.  It's not as if he filled every one of those positions with his old staff, some were new hires to him.  Why not keep some of them on to ease the transition.  And, as you mention, perhaps RR did do things during the first few weeks to give LC pause.  Sure, Bacon had a ton of access, but you don't think that there may have been conversations between LC and RR to which he was not privy?

3.  "It's a highly political chain of events, people can see it, and that's why so many people don't trust Lloyd."

If you go to the general M fanbase, I think that the OVERWHELMING majority trust Lloyd and not RR.

Section 1

October 26th, 2011 at 4:04 PM ^

...there have been a number of similar comments, supporting Carr.

My question to Carr and his players is this -- While you might have different views about Rodriguez as a coach, and perhaps not all positive, why would you all have remained silent when Rodriguez and the program -- your old football program -- were being attacked as per the Free Press and Rosenberg? 

Explain that to me; why wasn't it a competely unifying, galvanizing event?  A chance to rally behind Rodriguez and Michigan?  Why was something like MGoBlog the one voice in the wilderness?  A lot of people knew what bullshit it was.  Half the Athletic Deaprtment knew what bullshit it was.  Jim Brandstatter, Frank Beckmann, Brian Cook, Jon Chait, Bill Martin, David Brandon.. all at one time or another came around to the viewpoint that Michael Rosenberg was a menace, creating his own story.

So why weren't Lloyd Carr and his former players doing the same?  It hardly requires anybody to choose whether or not to support "Michigan."  Supporting Michigan, no matter who the coach was, virtually demanded confronting Rosenberg.

msoccer10

October 26th, 2011 at 4:17 PM ^

I know we were all happy to get rid of English at the time but looking back, what would have happened if Rodriguez only brought his offensive staff and kept all the Carr defensive staff. Interesting to think about.

BigBlue02

October 26th, 2011 at 11:40 PM ^

You tell me if this is "scum:"

You call a potential job candidate and tell him that you fully endorse him and think he will do great things for the program. Then, after he is hired, you backstab him.

Yeah, Miles is "scummy" and Lloyd is awesome.

TampaJake

October 26th, 2011 at 3:37 PM ^

This might not be popular either but...

Isn't the whole "Michigan Man" meme in the vain of the school is bigger than you?  So, taking that further to Carr, AFTER the decsion to hire RR, he should step up and whether he personally agrees or not, COMPLETELY support RR.  Completely, no questions, no qulaifiactions...this is the very definition of being part of something larger than you.  Michigan made a decison and as a paid employee of this institution, you line up and be counted.

You handle internal disagreements internally, not publicly and not with a booming silence when asked for input.  Then  to ACTIVELY engage in activities that implicitly undermine the new coach, well...there you go.

Change the names...Bo tells his players it's ok to leave Mo's team...What?  "Those Who Stay..."

michgoblue

October 26th, 2011 at 3:51 PM ^

I do think that LC should have done more to aid in the transition.  I actually agree with you on that. 

But, I like my coaches and former coaches to have integrity.  If he doesn't believe something, I don't want him on TV saying it.  If LLoyd didn't believe that RR was the guy, I respect him for not lying on TV.  I also respect him for NOT publicly trashing RR.  By remaining silent, he retained his integrity while at the same time doing no harm.

umchicago

October 26th, 2011 at 4:34 PM ^

lloyd was being paid handsomely to remain on board as a figurehead and help keep the program stablized.  if he was so incensed at the hiring of RR (who it seems he even recommended), he should have resigned.  UM could have used those $$ to bring in casteel. /s.

RR deserved a chance at success and not be undermined by lloyd and his former players.

hell, at the time i was outspoken against the hiring of amaker (lack of experience, success, etc). but once he was hired, i was one of his biggest supporters, saying that he deserved 4 years.  why? because that's the right thing to do.

bronxblue

October 26th, 2011 at 4:06 PM ^

1.  There is a difference between telling kids they have choices and actively stating "I'll sign your transfer papers" before the new coach even arrived on campus.  RR said he would let any kid transfer (and he followed through on that) provided they met with him first.  That seems reasonable to me, and Carr trying to circumvent that by telling kids they could leave beforehand is poor behavior, at best, from the departing HC.  And considering what he told Mallett before his transfer, you see a trail of departures at least implicitly supported by Carr.

2.  Not defending RR - the funny thing is, most of the former players speaking out against RR were either (a) kids who were kicked off/left the program on bad terms (and trust me, former players disliked Carr too) or (b) never played for RR but just didn't like the way he ran the program (i.e. hated to see UM lose).  Sure, that isn't officially on Carr to step in and tell those guys to keep their complaints in-house, but at the same time I find it hard to buy his "nobody is bigger than the team" bravado when he never really marshalled the media bitching by his former player.  And as for supporting RR, the outgoing coach who is now an associate AD needs to swallow his pride a bit and at least publicly support the head coach; that's the deal with being part of the athletic department.  If he doesn't want that responsibility, then stop cashing a check from UM and become a private citizen again.

3.  Nobody really cared that much about Braylon saying those things about Lloyd Carr's UM because, well, Braylon is kind of a tool (at least to me) who has a fine sense of self, and anyway, those little intros aren't the biggest deal.  But when you have guys who never played for RR (Mayes, Hart, Edwards, Toomer, etc.) coming out and knocking him in the media despite what appeared to be honest attempts by RR to reach out to them, that is distressing.  And yeah, Carr doesn't need to control his players, but then don't feed me lines about how you want to follow in Bo's footsteps and run UM like a top-notch program, because top-notch programs don't allow former players to bitch out the current regime in the media. 

I like Carr as a person; he sounds like a decent, nice human being.  But he screwed the pooch numerous times during RR's tenure, and he deserves some blame for the fiasco. 

msoccer10

October 26th, 2011 at 4:09 PM ^

#2 I totally get what you are saying, and no I wouldn't want him or his players to lie. But once there is a new coach, I think you owe it to the University to support him and do whatever you can to make that coach and thus the program successful. The classiest response I heard, and what I would have liked to hear from all Michigan people, was "I support the head coach of the University of Michigan, whoever it is". I heard that from some, but definetely not all.

Again, i wouldn't want anyone to lie. I want that to be the truth because the University is bigger than any one coach or  player.

#3 Coach Carr was associate (assistant?) athletic director. Since he was still part of the staff working to make Michigan great, he should have done anything he could to help the program. If talking to his former players would have mitigated some of the shit Rodriguez went through and thus help the team win some more games I don't think that is too much to ask. If he was not employed by the University I still think it would have been the right thing to do but wouldn't hold it against him if he didn't.

I hope we can all digest this book and move on within a few weeks. Hoke is the coach now. Rodriguez, Carr and Martin are gone. Its time to get back to being the greatest college football program in the country.

gbdub

October 26th, 2011 at 5:06 PM ^

Lloyd Carr was not just a former coach. He was getting paid $400k a year to be the Assistant Athletic Director. Supporting the program, the coaches, and the players WAS HIS JOB. Regardless of his personal feelings. If he was not willing to do that, he should not have been in Schembechler Hall. As it was, his performance, or rather lack thereof, in this role was detrimental to the success of the program. Lloyd made mistakes here - and that's true whether you liked the Rich Rod hire or not.

coastal blue

October 26th, 2011 at 6:35 PM ^

You're cool that he just left his own kids that he recruited to feel the effects of all the negativity, because he somehow judged before one season was played or after one season that the program would never possibly get better under RR (even as it did, albeit in a slight fashion)?

When you look at it through those LC-tinted shades (Crayloa color 1997, btw) I can see how you find no fault with the man and continue to place him on his unworthy pedestal.

mtzlblk

October 27th, 2011 at 5:43 PM ^

1. Imagine RR did the same on his way out. Offered to sign transfer papers or encourgaed players to leave in any way. You would be okay with that?

2. Carr called RR and was one of the people that brought him into the picture to avoid hiring Miles. He should back that up or not make RR an option in the first place. You can't make a mess then go dark while i unfolds, you are beholden to try and do what you can to make the best of the situation, and that would mean publicly supporting giving RR a chance. 

3. Everyone knows that Carr could have had some sway in the comments of his former players and did nothing to give them a better, more diplomatic way of expressing themselves, even if it was only by example. No he can't control them, but he could have been a much better leader in that respect.

If you think CArr left a somewhat empty cupboard, then he is even moreso bound to do what he can to help the person he left it too. Not less. 

JeepinBen

October 26th, 2011 at 3:14 PM ^

1/2 way through the book, will probably finish it tonight. What strikes me more than anything is the lack of help Rodriguez got from Martin after the hire. Or from Lloyd, or from anyone. The description of his first press conference was ridiculous. Had Rich been prepped on about 5 things, or said 5 things, his whole tenure would have been different. Things like "I grew up down the street from Yost." "I played for Nehlen who worked for Bo". With regards to the "Michigan Man" question in the press conference, rather than saying "I hope not they hired me!" If Rich had said "When Bo said that 'A Michigan Man should coach Michigan' about the basketball coach, what I believe he meant was that Michigan coaches have no reason to search for other opportunities. This is the best. A Michigan Man is someone who is all-in. 100% dedicated to this great University. I am that." How different would it all have been? What about if DB had handled this coaching transition and ended up with RR? Do you think RR would have had the press conference snafus? Or do we think DB might have just prepped him on a few soundbites that the media needed to hear, and everything would be good!?!

As the book says - Michigan hired Rodriguez, not the other way around. Yet there was precious little done by ANYONE to set him up to succeed.

JeffB

October 26th, 2011 at 7:13 PM ^

Uh, I guess I missed the part where his new boss took him aside and prepped him a bit before the press conference.
<br>
<br>Yeah, maybe he should have visited the city first, but timing dictated that he didn't. Should he have reached out on his own - absolutely. Was he naive about some things - again, absolutely.
<br>
<br>However, to say he had plenty of help bedew that intro press conference? I didn't see that in the book, so I guess I fail at reading comprehension, too.

lexus larry

October 26th, 2011 at 3:24 PM ^

"What about if DB had handled this coaching transition and ended up with RR? "

From what I've read, seen, watched over the past 4-5 years, THIS ^^^ is the paramount difference from the 2008 coaching transition to the 2011 version.

I think DB opened the Coordinator salary wallet, I think DB had people coach Brady on what to say, how to say it, etc.  I'm willing to go so far as to say that DB canvassed/eyed who the new DC should be, and it wasn't BH's "choice." 

It rankles to think that just a year ago, Michigan was paying GERG $250k, and now the AD is paying Mattison >$675k.  What if that money had been available 5 years ago, 7 years ago?  (And don't lump all coaching staff salaries together, in a lame effort to smear RR...it was up to the AD to make competitive salaries a top priority, and until Hoke was hired, Michigan coaching staff salaries weren't even close!)

JeepinBen

October 26th, 2011 at 3:30 PM ^

I hate the Jersey BS. I hate the mascot BS. I hate (most of) the RAWK BS. But DB really does the big picture stufff professionally and well.

The scoreboards in every building that matters.

The Crisler pictures that were posted today.

Adding Lacrosse as varsity sports.

I haven't gotten to this part of the book yet, but the NCAA Violations and Freep were handled masterfully by DB.

This coaching search/Brady's coachspeak/preparation/etc.

The skyboxes (yes Martin helped)

UCONN 2010.

UTL 2011

The Big Chill

DB is a pro. Now he also might be a pro in the Julia-Roberts-Pretty-Woman sense, all about the Benjamins, but on the big picture stuff, wow.

jmblue

October 26th, 2011 at 4:37 PM ^

I think Brian's got it backwards.  Yes, there are things Brandon does that are annoying.  But they're mostly nitpicks.  I don't want a mascot, or hear "Sweet Caroline," but those are trivial issues.  As far as the overall direction of the athletic department is going, it looks exceedingly positive, and that's ultimately how Brandon should be evaluated. 

JeepinBen

October 26th, 2011 at 4:45 PM ^

We don't want good enough. We want perfect (in our own minds. I know some people like the jerseys). And DB's handling of each and every thing (in my mind at least) hasn't been perfect.

Are Michigan fans ever satisfied? Are people? /philosophized

M-Wolverine

October 27th, 2011 at 11:35 AM ^

We were successful on that crappy pay scale for almost 40 years. Must mean Bo-Mo-Lloyd were even greater coaches than we thought to win more games than anybody with both hands tied behind their back. Imagine what they could have done if they had had top dollars to throw around.

Yooper

October 26th, 2011 at 3:16 PM ^

Wow.  That statement was a surprise and quite a turnaround.  I certainly agree.  Where do I go to get three years of Michigan football back?

M-Wolverine

October 27th, 2011 at 11:39 AM ^

From "needing" to be gone, to "glad" he's gone.  (With neither being "happy it didn't work out"...which I don't think many are). 

The thing I find interesting is that of all things it was locker room meltdowns...which really, didn't get much of a second look from me. I imagine there were many a damaged piece of furniture, or farmyard animal, back in Bo's day.

But maybe it gets even more excessive after the wheels start falling off in the last season.

jaws4141

October 26th, 2011 at 3:17 PM ^

I still don't see how Carr hurt RR.  If not for Carr RR would have never got the job.  He never would have made 10 million dollars for three years of failure.  RR owes Carr a hug if you ask me.

gremlin

October 26th, 2011 at 3:18 PM ^

Also, if anyone wants to complain about the "lack of help RR got" keep in mind that he was a head coach inheriting tier 1 facilities and the winningest college football program in the history of college football.  It's more of a joke he went 7-6 in his 3rd year than going 3-9 in his first year.  How many years do you need buddy?  O, Lloyd didn't help you out?  Cry me a river. If you're a great coach you convince the players to stay.  You adapt to your players skill sets.  You are responsible for hiring a competent staff.  If you fail to do so, it will cost you your job.  Again, do I need to go on?  The man was the HEAD COACH.  He was in charge.  He failed.  Get over it. 

JeepinBen

October 26th, 2011 at 3:26 PM ^

And we're 6-1. I wont speak for anyone when I say I'm not saying Rich did a perfect job. Or even a good enough job. But I met Rich. He's a good guy. He wanted to win. He wanted to succeed. He tried hard. Why do you hate him so much?

I supported Lloyd. I supported Rich. I support Brady. Read the book. You'll see that when Rich was hired he asked MSC and Martin "you know what kind of offense I run, right?" their response was "yes, we want you to run that here. " When asked why he installed his system to personnel that didn't fit it he said "If we install ours, the players don't know it. If we try to run something else, the players and the coaches don't know it."

Seriously. He obviously failed. He was fired. My question is, why do you hate him so much?

Read the book.

bronxblue

October 26th, 2011 at 3:32 PM ^

Ah yes, because at no point does the school, MSC, Martin, Brandon, boosters, other coaches, etc. ever enter into the equation.  RR made a bunch of mistakes, but his era was marked by failures across the university, not just at HC.

But of course, recognizing that would require you to read a damn book, so no wonder.

bronxblue

October 26th, 2011 at 3:27 PM ^

Still working my way through it - Kindle version is nice, but didn't start on the book until yesterday afternoon.

The stuff about Martin is downright embarrassing for a major college, and shows the level to which the entire AD was in need of a change.  Going from Dungy (?), to Ferentz(??), to Miles, to Schiano(???) and then to RR was stupefying.  While I am not enamored with Brandon, I will say that his bungling of the Hoke hiring looks light-years better than what Martin did after Carr.

As for the great Carr, he came across kind of how I expected; a good solider who kept the program chugging along but not a guy who really stepped up and "led" this school like Bo did.  His silence and reticence was often interpretted as stoic pride and thoughtfulness, but the more you read about him, the more you realize he just didn't want to screw up what Bo had done, and after Moeller's firing he did nothing more than keep his head down and not screw anything up too badly.  He never developed a coaching tree (Hoke is about it), never really pushed the envelope with the offense or defense, and seemed content to win against the bad teams and split with the good teams.  Off the field, he did good charity work and seems like a throughtful person, but as a departed coach and steward for the program, including the one that he handed off to RR, he failed in his duties, rather spectacularly.

WolverineLake

October 26th, 2011 at 3:32 PM ^

I'm pretty sure that behind the scenes the MGoBlogerati make a bet that they can use a $10 word in their posts.  

 

Today's word:  alacrity.

 

Kind of like these guys...

 

(I tried embedding the 'meow' scene from Super Troopers.  No idea if I did it right.  Kind of looks like a FAIL at the moment)

Erik_in_Dayton

October 26th, 2011 at 3:32 PM ^

The first thing that really caught my eye was that Brian and this blog were mentioned.  Aliens will read the book one thousand years from now and wonder what the hell "Kittens!" meant. 

tbliggins

October 26th, 2011 at 3:37 PM ^

Tony Dungy did not retire until after the 2008 season so he would have been in the middle of a 13-3 season during the clown show. Doesn't really affect the overall picture of Martin during the fiasco, but he wasn't a broadcaster and I doubt he was answering Martin's call at the time.