Quick Hoke Presser Tidbits: O-Line Taking Shape?
3/5 of the starting line for the opener? [Bryan Fuller/MGoBlog]
Brady Hoke held a presser this evening, and while Adam should have the full transcript up later, Brian asked me to do a quick rundown since this was a particularly newsworthy one. Let's start with—you guessed it—the offensive line, which seems to be taking form.
Mason Cole, Erik Magnuson, Jack Miller, Graham Glasgow and Ben Braden is likely your starting OL. per Hoke.
— Michael Spath (@Spath_Wolverine) August 14, 2014
That's from left to right, and confirms what Hoke said on the radio earlier today about Braden solidifying his spot at right tackle, with Mason Cole still holding strong at LT.
While Glasgow looks to be the starter at right guard, he's suspended for the opener; Kyle Bosch and David Dawson are competing to start against Appalachian State. As for concern that Kyle Kalis hasn't been mentioned much at all this fall, there's apparently good reason for his absence:
Sounds like Jack Miller's in position to start game one at center ... Right guard spot? Bosch and Dawson. Kalis' back is ailing.
— Nick Baumgardner (@nickbaumgardner) August 14, 2014
If Hoke is to be believed, Miller is in position to do more than just start the first game—according to the man in charge, Miller is outplaying Glasgow at center. That'd be great news, as it would allow Glasgow to work at guard—where he seems to be a better option than Bosch/Dawson—and let Miller provide an apparent upgrade at center over Michigan's most consistent interior lineman from last year (that is, admittedly, not a distinction worth throwing a parade over).
UPDATE: Per Angelique Chengelis, Hoke actually said that Kalis would be a starter—though one or both of them didn't specify where—if his back was healthy.
Hoke said Kalis has been held out w back (doesn't sound major), would be a starter. Miller has edge at center over Glasgow (out 1st game)
— angelique (@chengelis) August 14, 2014
That could mean Kalis would take over at left guard, Magnuson would slide over to left tackle, and Cole would move to the bench, or it could mean that Kalis would play right guard over Glasgow.
Michigan held a scrimmage on Wednesday, and in addition to Kalis, three other players were held out: Devin Funchess, Drake Harris, and Delano Hill. Harris is dealing with a hamstring injury, while Hill is reportedly two to three weeks away from returning from his broken jaw. No reason was given for Funchess' absence that I could find, so let's hope upon hope that it was simply "you're Devin Funchess, and we have no need to risk you."
Multiple spots are still up for grabs. Hoke praised the scrimmage performances of Derrick Green and Drake Johnson, while saying De'Veon Smith had a slow start. On the other side of the ball, Jake Ryan is the only linebacker who's locked down a starting spot.
Jabrill Peppers "has a handle" on playing nickel, so he's now getting some work in at cornerback. Given Michigan's depth there, that sounds very positive in regards to Peppers' development.
Adam will have the full transcript up at some point, but that should hold you over for now.
August 14th, 2014 at 7:31 PM ^
Lewan was new to the position when he got here, and was still a little undersized. He ended up being a great OL, but there was good reason for his early struggles.
August 14th, 2014 at 10:15 PM ^
He struggled, but was okay. That's basically what I hope Cole can do. It's absurd to expect him to Jake Long as a junior.
August 15th, 2014 at 11:33 AM ^
Jake was arguably the team's best player as a soph.
August 14th, 2014 at 6:26 PM ^
It's nice to see Miller having a strong camp at the center spot. There seems to be a lot of competition in the middle.
August 14th, 2014 at 6:27 PM ^
August 14th, 2014 at 6:27 PM ^
Before the start of fall camp I thought the starting line from left to right would be Mags, Bosch, Glasgow, Kalis and Cole. I know Cole seems to be a true LT but from what I saw from Braden in the spring (whiffing multiple times) and also some video of the michigan drill last week where he got HAD big time the two times he was shown in the drill. I thought Cole with his athletism might be moved over to right while keeping Mags at LT. While I think it is good news that coaches are saying Braden is doing well, I'll believe it when I see it since this was the same thing said last year about him up until game week when he was taken out of the starting line up. Seems like the coaches might be wishing he was great rather than actually being good. Miller at C is also a concern since last year I saw him engage at the line of scrimmage but get absolutely no push or worse yet get blown back into the back field. Let's hope he's gotten stronger over this past year because I do believe he has a good head on his shoulders but it the physical part I'll be interested to see. I really have no problem with Cole at LT since it sounds like he's a great athlete and is picking up the offense. Plus he has decent enough size to contend with weakside DEs rather than my previous thought of having him move larger strongside DEs at RT, plus it is extremely difficult to switch from LT to RT, moreso than some people think. And although few and far between, true freshman do start on the line from time to time. I can remember out here in LA when Winston Justice started at USC at LT as a true freshman and was great. Both have similar measurables and were highly recruited coming out of high schools with great coaches (Justice from Long Beach Poly). And lastly, too bad for Kalis, really like the kid and think he has loads of potential, I think eventually he puts it all together before his time is up here at UM.
August 14th, 2014 at 6:37 PM ^
Paragraphs. I'm begging you.
August 14th, 2014 at 7:03 PM ^
He just joined today. Paragraphs start tomorrow.
August 14th, 2014 at 7:14 PM ^
I think he needs 100 mgopoints before he can use paragraphs.
August 14th, 2014 at 7:17 PM ^
HAHA! Will do for next time. Writing my thesis as we speak. The paragraphs are loooonnnngggg.
August 14th, 2014 at 7:40 PM ^
Maybe you're not getting the concept of a paragraph then?
August 14th, 2014 at 8:19 PM ^
wish we had jake Long here to settle this issue
August 14th, 2014 at 10:46 PM ^
Me too.
August 15th, 2014 at 10:39 AM ^
to the disfuntionasl family
August 14th, 2014 at 9:33 PM ^
August 14th, 2014 at 6:29 PM ^
I hate to say it, but that's not a bad starting OL.
At center, Miller is a RS JR who is up to just about 300 lbs. He struggled last year, but a lot of that may be as a result of playing next to two freshmen at times and of Borges over-complexity of scheme. He also has two seasons of playing experience, which might make him a steady presence in the middle.
Cole at LT is worrying, but he certainly has the guru hype and the size. There's a reason that Hoke hasn't stopped raving about this kid.
Mags at LG - also highly rated recruit who has a year of playing experience
Braden at RT - not only was he highly-regarded as a rescuit, but the dude is 322 pounds!!!
Glasgow - while a walk-on, he was still our best interior OL last year. Should only improve this year with a full year of experience playing last season.
Overall, this is a pretty solid line. And, with our still talent (feels good to say that) we don't need this line to be elite - just average - and we will be just fine on offense. As far as I see it, we have one of the top 2 QBs in the conference, are very solid at RB if Green comes close to living up to his hype and have insanely good receivers. Once Butt comes back, we will also have a very good TE. If the OL holds up, we should put up a lot of points.
August 14th, 2014 at 7:07 PM ^
August 14th, 2014 at 10:29 PM ^
Is it really that hard to believe that Miller got better? I mean you can't on one hand say that playing underclssmen on OL is bad (IMO an accurate statement), and then on the other hand say a guy has no room to improve from RS SO to RS JR years. I mean, yeah, we haven't seen any indication of that, but that goes for anything with this team... they keep us in the dark and feed us BS. It is what it is, we'll just have to wait and see.
August 14th, 2014 at 10:58 PM ^
August 14th, 2014 at 11:25 PM ^
Hopefully not living in a house with Taylor Lewan this year will be the difference maker for him.
August 15th, 2014 at 12:39 PM ^
Not sure what you're basing this on. Unless it's direct or insider knowledge, it's pretty ridiculous speculation.
Miller wasn't terrible last year. Though I clamored for his replacement, I described him as an ideal back-up who shouldn't be starting. He got in front of people fine, but was overpowered much too often. If he's gotten a little stronger and the zone scheme helps him get out of the business of trying to overpower nose tackles (as was speculated in one of the other threads), he may be OK.
And BTW in The Wolvering preview Funk said he was surprised last year that Miller was terrible at guard (obviously different wording). Said he worked out well at C, but not at G, surprised him. But in the spring he came out much better at G. So that may explain why he didn't crack the lineup, given Glasgow stayed at C the rest of the year.
August 14th, 2014 at 6:38 PM ^
I'm not complaining, but I find it interesting that 3/5 likely starters at this point are 3* or less. It really goes to show how important experience (not to mention cohesion with the guy next to you) is on the line.
August 14th, 2014 at 6:38 PM ^
The coaches haven't been right in August about the starting center in October since Molk left. In 2012 they wanted Barnum and ended up with Mealer. In 2013 they wanted Miller and ended up with Glasgow.
Miller didn't last very long last year and never saw light of day as Magnuson, Burzynski, Kalis, Glasgow, Bosch were thrown into the lineup. Maybe he made a leap, maybe he's a better fit for the coaching transition...or maybe the coaches will make a change two days from now.
August 15th, 2014 at 1:16 AM ^
August 14th, 2014 at 6:43 PM ^
I sure hope for everyone's sake they are right cause those 5 dudes will make or break the entire season.
August 14th, 2014 at 7:15 PM ^
This team isn't useless without an O-line. A lot of the problems we had last year stemmed from Borges pretending those problems weren't there.
You can win without a decent O-line. It's hard, and especially hard against tough competition, so I still think we're anywhere between one and three years away from feeling good about taking on MSU or OSU. Having said that, 8-4 is likely and 9-3 not much of a stretch if Nuss has the Sun Tzu in him.
First, it's nice to have a good defense. The 1997 team had a shaky O-line and was good for only 20 points a game, but that was enough. This defense won't be THAT good, but they'll give the offense a chance.
Second, having a mobile QB helps. Borges really only used DG's legs as a scripted changeup but as a checkdown it can be devastating because there aren't enough linebackers to hold the edges, fill the gaps AND cover the zones. We're also loaded at receiver with Darboh, Canteen, Norfleet, Funchess, Chesson et. al. so they can really spread the field. Funchess at least will demand a double-team -- send him vertical on every play so the safety to his side can't help against the run game. Freddy Footwork out of the slot will be tough to single-cover with a linebacker. DG will probably have no run game (again) and maybe 2-3 seconds to get rid of the ball, but if they can successfully set up a West Coast type offense then they can force the linebackers to backpedal on every play. If they overplay the draw, that leaves only 3-4 guys on the line to defend the run. Even a crappy OL can handle that; just have them block IZ.
Point is, you can compensate for a shaky O-line by spreading the field, and for at least the first few games this team won't have a choice. The downside is that if the O-line is THAT bad, teams like OSU will be able to 2-gap on runs and bring pass rush with just their front four (since every play at least one of the OL is going to screw up a block) and that pretty much stops everything. So yeah, they'll probably murder this OL, but they're the outlier and I'll note MSU's vaunted "four horizontals" offense improved as last season progressed.
August 14th, 2014 at 7:40 PM ^
The '97 team had a shaky OL? The tackles were a frosh Backus and JR Jon Jansen who was All Big Ten. Guards were frosh Hutchinson on one side and either Dave Brandt or Chris Ziemann on the other, and Zach Adami was the starting center and was also All Big Ten.
I know that's not the best OL we've ever had, but it had 3 of the best individual linemen we've ever had (albeit two as youngsters) and another All Big Ten player. That's not our 2000 OL, but I wouldn't call it shaky either.
August 15th, 2014 at 10:19 AM ^
August 14th, 2014 at 9:52 PM ^
Between one and THREE years before we can feel good about taking on MSU and OSU? Man, a lot can change in three years. Hell, a lot can change in one year. MSU had a terrible offensive line all through 2012, and for the first half of 2013. They really improved down the stretch, and while they weren't on say, Alabama's level, they were certainly respectable, even one of the better lines in the Big Ten. I think something similar can happen to this team.
But anyway, three years from now, 75% of our roster will have exhausted their eligibility. I don't think three years is a good time frame for predicting anything in college football, unless you are building from scratch, which we are most certainly not. We have a slightly young, but deep roster in pretty much every position on the field, and by next year, the roster will be a talent-laden, upper classmen-filled roster. If our line even looks middling this year, next year could be a big, big year for Michigan football, with what should be one of the deepest, most talented rosters in Michigan history.
August 15th, 2014 at 11:10 AM ^
"Between one and THREE years before we can feel good about taking on MSU and OSU? Man, a lot can change in three years. Hell, a lot can change in one year."
Hence why I said between one and three years. Learn to reading comprehension.
August 15th, 2014 at 1:27 PM ^
August 14th, 2014 at 6:44 PM ^
August 15th, 2014 at 2:59 AM ^
Not choosing sides here, but an eventually great lineman who was good enough to start as a true freshman would not seem a good example in support of a staff's ability to develop linemen. Now if, say, LTT were to become a great lineman...
August 14th, 2014 at 6:47 PM ^
if he were healthy and starting Kalis would take Mags spot correct?
or am I wrong in assuming Cole is above Mags right now, due to him in the LT spot
August 14th, 2014 at 7:45 PM ^
Kalis would be RG if healthy.
August 15th, 2014 at 4:44 PM ^
Do you think Glasgow would slide to Center and MIller would be out? I guess we'll see if Miller really is out playing Glasgow at Center once Kalis returns. Hard to imagine Glasgow out of the lineup.
August 16th, 2014 at 2:28 PM ^
But Glasgow may have hit his ceiling while the more well reguarded recruits are starting to come on and show why the recruiting agencies decked them out with stars.
August 14th, 2014 at 6:45 PM ^
August 14th, 2014 at 6:53 PM ^
August 14th, 2014 at 10:37 PM ^
than he was last year. His advantage with snapping and signal calling was never said to be an issue. If he got stronger, I can easily see him moving in at center.
August 14th, 2014 at 6:55 PM ^
We also need to remember that, while important, the player by player analysis isn't the only factor that determines the success of the line as a whole. Last year, we suffered from inexperience but we also struggled because of the group's inability to "gel" for whatever reason.
So I wonder how Taylor is doing these days.
August 14th, 2014 at 7:35 PM ^
escalate regarding the kalis comment.
By tomorrow `Kalis' back is ailing' will be taken as an indication that he's been abducted by aliens.
Damn. I really hope it's a minor injury, though.
Edit: never mind then. Awesome update on Kalis.
August 14th, 2014 at 6:58 PM ^
August 14th, 2014 at 7:09 PM ^
August 14th, 2014 at 7:50 PM ^
Why is it concerning? It's actually older than many were projecting, which is a plus. And if Miller truly has passed Glasgow, and not just for App St, then that needs to be seen as a positive. This line now has two third year players and two fourth year players on it. And if Kalis comes back and bumps Cole, then our youngest player will be a third year player. That's not bad at all.
August 14th, 2014 at 8:11 PM ^
August 14th, 2014 at 8:46 PM ^
Miller's problem was that he is a little too small to be able to overpower nose tackles but the new zone scheme should be a huge benefit to his ability. Plus, he showed that we was able to not screw up line calls as much as Glasgow last year.
August 14th, 2014 at 11:18 PM ^
August 15th, 2014 at 1:10 AM ^
August 15th, 2014 at 1:23 AM ^
Yeah, exactly. I think he was 290 last year and 299 now. That's a 9lb additional, but there is likely 10-20 pounds of body reshaping going on as well. He could have added 19lb of muscle and lost 10lb of fat, for example. That makes for a much more able offensive lineman.
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