Photos From The Fire Dave Brandon Rally Comment Count

Ace

What started with a message board post became a law student wearing an Ohio State sweatshirt in protest:


This and all following photos: Ace Anbender/MGoBlog

While at first it appeared the media members would outnumber the protestors, that changed in a hurry, with the assembled crowd alternating chants of "Fire Brandon," "We Want Harbaugh," and "Down With Dave."

A little while in, a small group chanted "Schlissel's House!" Lo and behold, a few minutes later, the protest had moved to the university president's front lawn:


“I’m proud of our history. I’m not proud of Dave Brandon being a part of that history.”

The guy with the megaphone—I didn't catch who he was, but since he was interviewed by several media outlets, I'm sure it'll get out there—spoke for a while about his pride in the University's athletic history, his support of the students and athletes, and the failure of Dave Brandon to protect either. The rally ended with a mocking "Dave Sucks" chant and a rendition of The Victors. A certain blogger may or may not have been interviewed on live television.

The full set of photos from the rally is embedded below. I'd estimate the turnout ended up at somewhere around 400-500 people—not bad for something that started just hours earlier on a message board...

Comments

bronxblue

September 30th, 2014 at 11:32 PM ^

Again, it was one play later that Hoke pulled him, and it wasn't "blatantly obvious" to everyone that Morris had a concussion.  Nobody ignored the issue then, and the aren't ignoring it now.  For all the straw people that I've been accused of creating and burning down, it annoys me to no end this argument being put forth that there was some cover-up or knowing violation of a player's well-being by Hoke.  By all meaningful accounts, there was a communication breakdown that led to Hoke and co. leaving Morris out there, and that is unacceptable at this level.  But it wasn't more than that, and this attempt to make it a moral referendum on Hoke and this staff is a disservice to everyone involved.

And just for the record, the argument that "No one shoots themselves in the chest at 50 from an old foot fracture" isn't true.  I had a family friend who injured himself as a voluneer fireman in such a way that a foot injury led to chronic pain in his back.  Nearly drank/pilled himself to death a couple of times to deal with it.  I know it is an extreme example, but players getting injured in this sport should apply to everyone and to every type of injury, not just the one that gets the big media attention.  All injuries follow you around, and that's a part of the sport.  People should be pissed Morris was still out there, I just think most weren't nearly as angry about him playing before that hit than afterwards.

gbdub

October 1st, 2014 at 12:22 AM ^

I was bothered that no one took action on Saturday. I'm furious about how Brandon and Hoke handled it Sunday and Monday. Had Hoke said the equivalent of what Schissel said today on Sunday, I'd drop the issue.

Am I madder than I'd be if we were 5-0? Probably. But we're not 5-0 - this comes after a series of incompetence and treating fans like idiots. Anger is additive, and we started from a high baseline anger level. We already wanted Hoke and Brandon gone - the only place to go is to want them gone sooner. I really don't see why this is so hard to accept. "You're madder than you'd be if everything else was perfect!" Why do you think this is such a scathingly effective argument?

I also don't see why it's so hard to accept that head injuries are especially bad, and not just because the media says they are. We've gotten pretty good at fixing musculoskeletal stuff. We're still pretty clueless about fixing long term brain damage and mental illness.

dragonchild

September 30th, 2014 at 9:52 PM ^

Devin Gardner and Molk knew their feet were FUBAR, were aware of the risks (Molk said he was aware his NFL career was on the line) and in fact Molk started the game on the sideline.  They both made conscious decisions to play.  Molk in particular refused painkillers because he wanted to "feel what I was doing to my foot".  In these cases I can respect their decisions as adults.

The problem with Morris is that he was HIT IN THE HEAD.  He was INCAPABLE of making decisions for himself, which is why every goddamn concussion policy in the country takes that decision OUT of the player's hands.  Which is why the coaches' use of Morris waving them off is so unacceptable it's basically a confession that they were grossly negligent.  It's as damning as, "Well, Your Honor, I didn't kill that person.  I just held up the gun, aimed it and pulled the trigger."

Furthermore, there's one other huge difference between feet and brains you're not addressing:  We can fix feet.  We literally played athletes who have fully recovered from foot and leg injuries, including but not limited to:  ankle sprains, broken feet, torn ACLs, broken legs.  We have no established treatment for brain trauma.  None.  It's something we can't fix.  If we had those nifty medical pods in "Elysium" frankly I wouldn't care if Morris' brain was mashed into goo because we could always rebuild him ("we have the technology") but we DON'T have the technology.

snarling wolverine

September 30th, 2014 at 10:30 PM ^

Let's not go overboard here.  Gardner hurt his foot during the game, and no one knew it was a fracture at the time.  They don't take X-rays right on the sidelines.   It's not uncommon for guys to play through pain in their lower body.  Comparing that to a head injury is apples and oranges.

Jalm

September 30th, 2014 at 11:13 PM ^

The consequences of having a broken foot and injuring it further is probably not as bad as second impact syndrome which you know... could be fatal. A little different I think. Plus I think the effects of a concussion could hamper the ability to make sound decisions, I'm not a doctor though, but I did stay at a Holiday inn.

dragonchild

September 30th, 2014 at 9:23 PM ^

But caring is only half the battle.  It doesn't matter how much he cares if he's too stubborn to do the most basic things to protect his players and put them in the best position to succeed.

I believe Denard, but I think he's missing the point.  There are plenty of accusations of malice but the calls to fire Hoke really don't care if he's evil or stupid -- it's based on the results.

BornInAA

September 30th, 2014 at 11:28 PM ^

That's why there has to be checks and balances. I coach youth football, the parents say "listen to coach" - they hear this for years... it's a lot of power and you are a father figure.

Denard probably loves the guy, and many of you love your father - but it is hard to call your own father out.

Lasell

September 30th, 2014 at 9:15 PM ^

The "We Want Harbaugh" chants make me uneasy about this whole thing. I think that what Brandon and Hoke have done in terms of disregaurd for player saftey is reprehensible and forcing the university to come to address this issue is admirable. For many people this seems to be THE issue. But, for other individuals (as evidence of the chant), I'm concerned that they are using it as oppurtunistic leverage to get a football coach that will win more games. And that if it is true or even percieved to be true, is much more problematic. I'm concerned that this can dilute the original message of "the athletic department should protect athletes especially from brain trauma." There's a reason this message resonated enough to be covered by Al Jazeera and NYT and it's beyond W's and L's. 

dragonchild

September 30th, 2014 at 9:28 PM ^

This can't be proven and is being used to undermine the fans' concerns.

I've heard barely a peep about the goddamn game and Michigan just got manhandled by Minnesota.  No, wait, I've heard some people talk about it. . . like that asshole on Deadspin who claims we're ONLY complaining about Morris' concussion because the team sucks.  That's who's talking about the game.

This is the most asinine thing I've ever heard.  If we wanted to complain about the team sucking, we'd just complain about it.  We have been for weeks now.  What excuse do we need?

LJ

September 30th, 2014 at 9:44 PM ^

Of course it can't be proven, but use some common sense.  Can you think of one example of a fanbase raising hell because of an ethical issue like this where the coach was successful?  I can only think of one: Joe Pa, in which the moral failure was magnitudes worse than this one, and the fanbase STILL largely supported the coach until he was literally impossible to defend.  And I can think of many, many cases where fanbases have let morally shady actions comepletely slide because of a coach's success.  You don't see a lot of Alabama and LSU protests about oversigning and cutting players, do you?

LJ

September 30th, 2014 at 10:09 PM ^

If you really think this fanbase is so different--unique compared to every other one in the country, more power to you.  I am skeptical, based on every other similar situation I have ever seen.

Jalm

September 30th, 2014 at 11:04 PM ^

Thanks Herbstreit. If we were winning who's to say we wouldn't get more coverage? Its not like the ticket prices and other complaints weren't an issue anyways with DB, winning or not. Sure the ticket prices don't reflect the product, but the prices are still among the highest in the country. You also can't tell me the national media cares about Michigan's record in regards to the concussion incident. Please let us know if you think this is overboard and think that Hoke's call/PC answers, and Brandons handling is no big deal.

SmithersJoe

October 1st, 2014 at 12:08 AM ^

Let's imagine 2 different drivers are pulled over for speeding by the same police officer on the same road going the same speed. One has a clean record, immediately takes responsibility and commits to ensuring it doesn't happen again. The other has a record of multiple traffic violations, reacts defensively to the officer, and insists that it was the passenger's responsibility to keep an eye on the speedometer. 

While both drivers might receive speeding tickets, we can understand if the officer chooses to issue a warning to the first driver, or if the court applies a more lenient sentence to the first driver.

Context does matter, and it's unfair to the protesters to insist that they should always treat each event in isolation and ignore the context.

LJ

September 30th, 2014 at 9:38 PM ^

Of course I understand how free speech works.  But I think you're in la la land if you think the response to this would be remotely similar had Hoke won the B1G last year.  Where was the "protect student safety" outrage over the Gibbons debacle?  It didn't exist, because the fans didn't yet want Hoke and Brandon ousted based on performance.  Now that everyone already wants them gone, it's easy to interpret every aspect of Morris-gate in the light least favorable to Hoke, becuase it leads everyone to the outcome they already want, based on what they really care about: winning games.

dragonchild

September 30th, 2014 at 10:00 PM ^

We didn't have visibility into the Gibbons debacle.  It was all handled behind closed doors.  EVERYONE saw what happened on Saturday, so we don't even care what was decided in the closed-door meetings.

Again, if you think this is all just a show, fine.  But baseless allegation is baseless.

Trolls are out in full force tonight.  I guess it's due to the media attention, so it's to be expected.

enlightenedbum

September 30th, 2014 at 10:01 PM ^

There was fairly widespread outrage about the Gibbons thing.  Though it was caught up in various unsavory elements of American culture.  And also highly relevantly, we had very little idea what happened.  We have the police report, which I definitely think points in a certain direcition, but evidence was never presented publicly and there was no charge filed.  So there's wiggle room.

With Shane Morris we all saw exactly what happened.  Makes it very hard to lie.  Which they did.

bronxblue

September 30th, 2014 at 10:30 PM ^

Another factor involved was that the actual incident occurred under RR and had this weird dormancy during which Title IX changes required a second review.  Had it all occurred under Hoke, perhaps the outrage would have been different.  And, sadly, as we've seen with guys like Winston, football and sex can be a very divisive mix.

I do take issue with the idea that Morris's situation was as black-and-white in the moment as people are making it out to be in retrospect; the outrage seems mostly to be with how Brandon and Hoke handled it in the press afterwards, coupled with a healthy dose of online/media vigilantism.  I've always said Hoke and Brandon should be gone because both are bad at their jobs, but I maintain that the idea they are lying/covering up for something is the Occam's Razor argument when the much more obvious answer is that both of them are just incompetent. 

bronxblue

September 30th, 2014 at 11:20 PM ^

I'm not going to get too into this because neither side is going to budge, but the simple fact that you couched your claim with "probably" shows the uncertainty that surrounded that whole situation when it was happening in real time.  Hindsight and all, but I had a much bigger issue with Hoke failing to get Morris out of there when he was clearly limping around with an ankle injury than for how quickly he pulled Morris out after that hit.  The prior goes to his pigheadishness in keeping true to a bad decision; the latter is more a systemic failure on Michigan's sideline than Hoke somehow knowingly (or at least negligently) risking a player's health because of a potential concussion that nobody handled all that well.

GGV

September 30th, 2014 at 11:23 PM ^

You are right in that IF everything else were running as it should, then this incident wouldn't have become such a shit-storm.   That's not the point. Herbstreit & Howard are making the same mistake.

The Morris incident, while very important on its own, is also a symptom of larger problems of leadership and organization in the football program and athletic department.

Students and alumni treated as customers & gouged for money rather than valued members of the Michigan family.

Questionable search practice for Hoke. (search may have been rigged, best people for the job not offered, etc...)

Suspicion, reports and observations of inappropriate involvement of Brandon in micromanaging the football program ((Hoke is more of a figurehead?)

Lies and obfuscation rather than truth and transparency in dealing with the concussion issue.

Policies resulting in lack of interest in game attendance.

Zero player development

Mounting player injuries

Uninspired play

No observable leadership on or off the field...

A lot of this stuff is difficult to fully define, but we know it all smells rotten...We know something is deeply wrong in the athletic department.  The Morris incident is just the most recent, most egregious and easiest to define.

 

 

 

jdon

September 30th, 2014 at 9:29 PM ^

it was BAMN and real life issues... now we have protests to fire coaches/Athletic directors?

lame.

 

I get it, people had fun, but seriously there is so much more important stuff going on out there that for 500 people to get together and not address something of substance is a little bit of an insult to our storied history of defiance.

 

dragonchild

September 30th, 2014 at 10:04 PM ^

I see you're on here voicing your superior opinion rather than out fixing the world yourself.

If it makes any difference, last week I donated one-third of my take-home pay to charity.  But you see, my daily activities aren't limited to one thing.

gbdub

September 30th, 2014 at 11:06 PM ^

Our storied history of defiance. Because all those student government resolutions about Israel and Hash Bashes have sure accomplished a lot. At least this might get something done. Certainly more than bitching about it on a sports blog.

Julius 1977

October 1st, 2014 at 9:26 AM ^

I protested in that very same spot when Nixon fired Elliot Richardson.  The next few years they protested apartheid there.

There's only a thousand of them.  That's probably the same thousand that show up on time.

The guy on the front page of MGBlog is wearing OSU garb.

Right or wrong, the AD's actions that affected this group was a reaction to their own apathy.

Very credible.