Do we all agree that this is the biggest area of need for UM left on the board? Any thoughts in this category - it looks bad for the future of the line.
here's one vote for "John Beilein's head in a Futurama jar"
IMHO, you're right that it's the biggest area of need, with outside receiver second and safety/defensive line tied for third.
I wouldn't be *that* worried about the future, between the strong class of linemen we picked up last year and the fact that we are returning all our starters (such as they are). One more, maybe two would be nice for this class, and it looks like we'll pick up at least one between now and signing day. So don't worry too much.
I would agree but it is also the one area where UM is in the running for a lot of high caliber guys. Also, OL recruiting is a crap-shoot and getting a couple of low level 3* isn't as catastrophic as it would be if you got that at LB or QB. I would be more worried about LB & S.
They picked up 6 guys last year. All of them red shirted so that's 6 guys with 4 years of eligibility left.
Here are the guys that played most this year:
Dorrestein: 2 years of eligibility left.
Ferrara: 2 yrs.
Huyge: 3 yrs.
McAvoy: 1 yr.
Molk: 3 yrs.
Moosman: 1 yr.
Nowicki: 2 yrs.
Ortmann: 1 yr.
Schilling: 2 yrs.
I'd say they look pretty good depth wise for next year. Everyone has eligibility left. The only question is will anyone leave the program? Also, Zirbel is probably done with football so that hurts as he was supposed to be one of the better guys this year.
After that, for the 2010 season you're only losing 3 guys (if everything goes right as far as injuries and attrition), leaving them still with 12 players and that's not including whomever comes in this year and next as freshman.
I completely agree with this assessment. Between the group that redshirted and what is coming back, there is going to be a ton of depth at OL. The nice thing is that despite the rough start, the group that played this season really progressed nicely by the end of the season, and if memory serves me correctly none of them were really that highly touted. To me, OL is one of those areas where experience and continuity is really the key.
According to Rivals Michigan are recruiting these guys the hardest:
Quinton Washington from South Carolina, 4 stars
Taylor Lewan from Arizona, 4 stars
Chris Freeman from Ohio, 3 stars
Travis Bond from NC, 3 stars
Those guys were listed as Michigan's "sweet 16" of recruiting targets. So, 4 out of 16 is a fairly good amount, OL is still a need, obvs.
Travis Bond is a UNC lean at this point. His HS coach is pushing him that way. He was at NC State yesterday wearing a Wolfpack toboggan, but will probably end up in Chapel Hill.
not at all, we're fine in terms of OL recruiting
Yeah, I'm not sure what this post means. The O-line looks like it's going to develop ok, especially this years freshman. It's just going to take time.
we could use OL but we need LBs and DBs
I have complete faith in RR and the offensive coaches when it comes to recruiting and developing the players they get on the offensive side of the ball. Their track record speaks for itself. Brandon Minor averaged 5.2 YPC this year. It's going to get better on offense.
It's defense where we need to be looking and somewhat concerned. I'm not saying I don't trust the defensive coaches, because they deserve more than one year to show what they're capable of, but in terms of the players on the field, it's obvious we need some fresh blood. Watching the Ohio State game again, some of the runs Wells and Herron busted off are obscene to watch. We need linebackers that can shed blocks and make tackles in space, and we need safeties who aren't failures at pretty much everything. Watch Chris Wells on his touchdown run. Thompson and Ezeh get completely erased, and Harrison runs up and gets washed away with Thompson, and Wells is gone. I understand Wells is almost impossible to bring down when he gets a head of steam, but Harrison took himself completely out of the play by basically running into Thompson, who was in the process of getting wiped out. I suspect/hope Harrison is in for a big fat -2 in Brian's UFR.
I don't know if Emilien is the answer, or Smith, or M-Rob in 2010, but I certainly hope so. As for this year, if I'm the coaches, I put the full court press on Jelani Jenkins. David Harris erased a LOT of mistakes in 2005 and 2006. Jenkins has the look of another linebacker who's so instinctive and so athletic, he can make a lot of plays that erase mistakes by other players.
Clarence -- I believe that both Molk and Shilling were highly regarded, but both are young (Molk in particular).
Guess my memory's not so good. Thanks for the clarification. The good thing about that is that Molk, from what I've seen, looks like he's going to turn out to be pretty darn good.
Schilling was a five star recruit, he's turned out pretty decent. Improvement next year would be nice.
Schilling was a top-10 national recruit, and a five star. Molk, I think, was only three. Mooseman would be our next highest-rated lineman (though I think by comparison, he'd be lower than O'Neill and Barnum).
As to the main post, if we can bring in one other OL in addition to Schofield, that would be fine. I'm infinitely more concerned with LB's and CB's right now, as we badly need a 3rd CB (I have no idea who our nickel would be right now) and we only have a single LB capable of shedding block (Mouton). The more I think about him, the more pessimistic I get about Ezeh's future.
Molk was a 4-star on Rivals. I'm not sure about Scout.
Justin Turner would be the 3rd CB...which would be Warren, Cissoko, and a true freshman.
My guess is that JT Floyd or Troy Woolfolk would play nickel corner as of this moment. A safety tandem of Steve Brown and Brandon Smith would be an invitation for many 80 yard TD passes, so I think Williams has to drop back to FS and Brown has to move to SS.
DB's next year:
CB - Warren
CB - Cissoko
FS - Williams
SS - Brown
nickel - Floyd
This seems to make the most sense to me, as it doesn't seem to be automatic that Justin Turner plays CB for us. I don't know for a fact - but if he has the speed to play CB, why wouldn't he play CB in high school? Isn't it rare for a HS CB to become a college safety. Throw out his physical attributes, and he still would have to learn the position.
So, Magnus, while I agree with you, that lineup you list sorta scares the hell out of me. Floyd/Woolfolk and Williams are largely unknowns, and Brown is Brown.
at the high school level, corner can be kind of a waste for a big talent. you just dont face the wrs and passing games to make them important. safety puts them in the thick of the game
As bsb said, many college corners played FS in high school. Many teams put their best athlete at FS because he can make plays on both sides of the field and be a safety net for the weaker athletes up front. When a good athlete plays corner in high school, the opponent can scheme to throw/run away from him. In my experience playing and coaching, the free safeties have always ended up with the most interceptions at the end of the season.
What about Brandon Smith? Wasn't RR real high on him, but didn't get a chance to play because of an illness?
I've been impressed with Mike Williams. He's always making plays on special teams and got a little action on d.
When Brandon Smith came out of high school, he needed a LOT of work on pass coverage. Considering that Steve Brown will probably be lined up somewhere at safety, I doubt they'll throw Smith and Brown out there together. Like I said, that would be an open invitation for 80 yard TD passes.
coaches were pretty high on B Smith but the appendicitis caused him to miss most of the season. Might be weak in pass coverage but I'm sure he would have gotten a little PT. Hopefully he makes big strides in the offseason because we def need a playmaker back there.
I don't care who is back there as long as we get some interceptions. We didn't have that many until the end of the year..
I think Smith would have earned some time on special teams and playing SS close to the line. He's much more of a SS than a FS and could be used to stop the run or blitz off the edge. The problem is, he and Steve Brown are both strong safety types and none of our safeties is very good at pass coverage. Hopefully Williams is an exception, and I'm expecting Justin Turner to be a free safety as well.
We need to start taking other teams' philosophy and turn corners into safeties.
We don't really have an abundance of corners that we can convert to anything. We shorter at CB than any other position. This is also why most people feel that Turner will be at CB, at least to start. We have very little depth there, and no one other than him in our incoming class so far. Unless you count Peace, who might be a WR and might not be coming.
Yeah, I'm not saying we should convert too many current corners to safety. I mean we should try converting supposed incoming corners to safety. And maybe it should start with Turner.
Stevie Brown seems more FS than SS to me actually. He's not that good in run support and misses a lot of tackles. I assumed he was better in coverage actually, could be way off though.
Brown is pretty horrible in coverage.
He does miss tackles, but he seems to miss those tackles in space. I think he's better when he's attacking the line of scrimmage, blitzing off the edge, etc. He can hit but he just has brain farts when there's a chance someone might juke him. I think he'd be better off closer to the line of scrimmage instead of being the last line of defense.