Morgan Trent Is Not All In Comment Count

Brian

greek-riots-police-eu morgan-trent-ron-english

Another week, another riot. We are all Greek. The cause of this one:

At the end of the book, Deren describes the scene with Lloyd Carr, the former Michigan head coach that recruited Trent to Ann Arbor, breaking the news to Trent that current head coach Rich Rodriguez did him no favors.

“Rodriguez had bad-mouthed him to every NFL scout he could,” Deren writes. “Rodriguez claimed that Morgan was lazy, he had an attitude problem and he was a big reason the Wolverines finished with a 3-9 record…”

Trent admits the words were “jarring,” and they were hard to understand given that he was so serious about his career that he actually moved in with his brother and sister-in-law and their two small children while going to Michigan. [ed: "Morgan Trent was so serious about football he decided to save on rent."]

But Trent was also worried about what Carr thought about his words showing up in the book. He talks to him, not Rodriguez. “I really like Coach Carr. He’s been very good to me,” Morgan says. “I think at first he was wondering, but I let him know it didn’t put him in a bad light. I would never do something like that to Lloyd. He’s great.” …

“I guess it was motivation,” Morgan says of the words that Deren estimates may have cost him $1 million. “(I) want to show people it was all false.”

Consider it done.

Here we go again, after one hell of a game of telephone from Rodriguez to NFL scout—at this point the story can get passed to and fro ad nauseum—to Carr to Trent to book author Deren. Rodriguez issued a denial

“The comments attributed to me are inaccurate and absolutely ridiculous,” Rodriguez said in a statement. “I said just the opposite about Morgan Trent to NFL scouts and wish him well with the Bengals.”

…but even so, don't you kind of believe it anyway? Don't you sort of want to believe it? I believe Rodriguez told NFL scouts some version of what Deren says. I also believe that Trent was a lazy player with an attitude problem who was one of the main reasons Rodriguez's first team was a jumbled sack of cats attempting to claw in 20 different directions. Even if he didn't say it, I believe the words attributed to Rodriguez are accurate.

Trent's personal animosity towards Rodriguez has been made plain. We've previously established around here that football players are not compliance experts and the distinction between countable and non-countable hours befuddles even said experts. A former player's opinion on Michigan's we're-talking-about-stretching violations says more about his relationship with Rodriguez than anything about the violations. It's a Rorshach test. What Morgan Trent sees*:

"I'm not surprised because I know what happened, and I know what kind of rules were broken. I couldn't see how they were going to get out of that."

"Whatever steps need to be taken (to restore Michigan's winning tradition), I'm all for it. What is happening right now obviously is not working. I don't know how long they're going to let this last until changes are made."

What Brandon Graham sees:

"Coach Rod’s a good coach, and people are just trying to get him in trouble to me," Graham said.

So Morgan Trent is not disposed to give Rodriguez the benefit of the doubt when Lloyd Carr convenes a special meeting of the Anti-Rodriguez illuminati with the express purpose of revealing the dastardly secret carried about by Rich Rodriguez…

stonecutters_song_1

who controls the practice logs?
who puts Michigan Stadium in a bog?
weeeeee dooooooo… we do!

…that any Michigan fan could already have told you.

Here is the reason Morgan Trent went in the sixth round:

coverbad1_thumb coverbad2_thumb coverbad5_thumb

this happened like eight times in that game

He was not particularly good at football. He badly regressed after a promising junior season. Then when he went to the Shrine Bowl he "struggled," reinforcing the opinion of scouts "already down on him." The reason for this is now obvious: he hated the transition to Rodriguez, probably hated the coach himself, and spent a year half-assing it. The responsibility for this lies with Morgan Trent, even if he was so serious about football he lived with relatives(!). Attempts to deflect it only reinforce the very criticism (possibly) leveled by Rodriguez. It had nothing to do with the quality of the team, as Trent claims elsewhere in the article. A guy from Hillsdale went in the third round this year. The Bengals hadn't even talked to Rodriguez and still waited and waited and waited to take him.

During the very moments when Trent was doing whatever it was that made him a team cancer, Brandon Graham was turning himself into a first-round pick. We have not had any reports on what Rodriguez told NFL scouts about Brandon Graham, but dollars to donuts they were along the lines of "draft this man first overall and ask if he will adopt your kids." The reason Rich Rodriguez would say this is because of the things Brandon Graham did. You see, Rudy?

Now, there are a disturbing number of people who look at the Rich Rodriguez inkblot and see big pointy teeth. One major reason for this is that Rodriguez appears to be much harder on his players than Lloyd Carr. It's the very tippy top of the peak of hypocrisy for any Bo-venerating Michigan fan to look down on Rodriguez for this (his failure to resemble Bo in the win column is another matter). Part of that veneration is accepting the idea that being a coach often involves being very harsh to people who aren't living up to your expectations.

I wish that Rodriguez had managed to enter more smoothly but don't really blame him for the massive culture clash no one from fans to players to athletic director anticipated. He has a track record.

To be perfectly blunt and enraging to the denizens of the comments who get enraged when people pop on here and say dumb MLive-type things about departed players, I do blame Trent. Michigan is not going to be in good shape if Rich Rodriguez leaves after this year, and Trent would clearly like to see that happen and is operating either without a care as to how his inability to suck it up affects the program or with the express intent of getting rid of Rodriguez. Loyalty to the institution does not occur to him. It appears that correcting the record is so important to him that he's willing to sell out his alma mater to refute allegations that may not have actually happened and no one knew about. In doing so he's convinced me that the potentially fictional and definitely obscure allegations are true.

So… congratulations Morgan. You've invented a variant on the Streisand Effect.

As for Carr, he gave explicit permission to Trent to sell Rodriguez out in this book:

But Trent was also worried about what Carr thought about his words showing up in the book. He talks to him, not Rodriguez. “I really like Coach Carr. He’s been very good to me,” Morgan says. “I think at first he was wondering, but I let him know it didn’t put him in a bad light. I would never do something like that to Lloyd. He’s great.”

No, just Rodriguez. Any question as so whether or not there is a major rift between the two coaches is now gone. If there wasn't, Carr would have talked to Rodriguez about it. He would have gotten some clarification or a denial or something, and he wouldn't have presented it to Trent in the fashion he did. If he didn't do that, he would have told Trent to shut up when given the opportunity.

If there is really a New Era of Accountability in the athletic department, Carr and David Brandon should have a come-to-Jesus meeting in which Brandon does a lot of screaming. Trent is a pissed-off kid who was working for a scholarship. Carr is supposedly a program icon and an athletic department employee. Michigan shouldn't be paying someone who is actively working against the interests of the athletic department. It's obvious that Carr could have helped smooth things over with any number of players but chose not to, chose to exacerbate things in certain situations. He could have been of help during the transition; he was the opposite.

Through it all, Rodriguez just grits his teeth and asks if you've heard his Lion King joke. I shudder at the tell-all book that will inevitably follow a Rodriguez canning.

*(meta: I had to link to a mgoboard message board post instead of the News because the News shoved their story behind a paywall a month after they posted it. No one is ever going to pay for that article. Go newspapers.)

Comments

Route66

May 10th, 2010 at 5:19 PM ^

Keep talkin' Morgan.  You are only making yourself and others look bad.  Glad we can finally have LC's sentiments in writing.  Dang Coach, either leave or get on board. 

Thanks to Brian for writing this and not towing the company line.  I can't imagine your angst for having to sit on this for the last year and a half.

SouthU

May 10th, 2010 at 5:24 PM ^

.... and then proves it's a Rorshach test by reading an obvious game of telephone (seriously, the only thing missing is "PURPLE MONKEY DISHWASHER") as proof that Carr has an agenda. 

Full disclosure: I am a Carr fan, so further proof of the Rorshach test.

I can't believe it's still early May.  This is going to be the longest off-season EVER.

arod

May 10th, 2010 at 5:42 PM ^

is a big fucking bag of shit.  To throw Carr under the bus based on speculation from some hersey stuff in a book that dozens of people will read is silly.  Moreover, it is disloyal to a man who has done infinitely more for Michigan, and not just in terms of football, than RR.  That' s not meant to slight RR, who may eventually have a career equal to or greater than Carr, but rather to point out how much Carr has done for this program.  It's no better than the Freep ripping on RR because a hobo sleeping in front of the AD's office heard RR tell Carr to quote, " lick my crusty asshole, you old turd."

 

Furthermore, suppose it's true that Lloyd doesn't like RR.  In the orgy of excuses that has been the RR era, has anyone ever stopped and thought, "Man, it seems really weird that all these people just happen to want RR to fail, even though he is totally awesome and has never done anything dickish to piss anyone off or contribute to this own failure.  Hmm, maybe the implausibility of all these people deciding to shit on RR for various reasons, none of which are his fault, speaks against my hypothesis that RR is God's gift to Michigan football."

 

Also, Morgan Trent played in 16 games for the Bengals this season.  So he might be a pretty good football player.   RR MAY HAVE spoken negatively to scouts about Trent, but worse than that, in my opinion, is that he was wrong about him.  I don't have any problem with coaches honestly evaluating players, but when you do so and go negative you run a big risk.  If you're positive and you're wrong, you end up looking like a guy trying to help his players.  If you're negative and you're wrong, you look like a big dumbass. To me the only significant result of this story, if it's true, is that RR looks like a poor evaluater of defensive talent, which may hurt recruiting.  Everything else is just a bunch of shit.

 

 

PurpleStuff

May 10th, 2010 at 6:17 PM ^

He made 28 tackles in those 16 games and never intercepted a pass.  He broke up a pass once every four games.  He was not a starter.  His team just signed Pacman Jones, of all people, to replace him in the lineup.  Trent basically played just like a 6th round pick despite being one of the most physically gifted corners in last year's draft class.  He proved no one wrong.

arod

May 10th, 2010 at 6:46 PM ^

he seems to have out done his fellow sixth round CBs:

 

Cary Harris - 4 games.

Brandon Underwood- 11 games, 11 tackles.

Brice McCain- 16 games, 15 tackles

Coye Francies- 4 games,  4 tackles

Do Carey- never played.

 

Here are some of the stats of guys who went ahead of him:

Alphonso Smith, 2nd round- 14 games, 14 tackles

Sherrod Martin, 2nd round- 16 games, 23 tackles, 3 picks.

Bradley Fletcher, 3rd round- 7 games,  23 tackles

Derek Cox, 3rd round-  16 games, 72 tackles (!) and 4 picks.

Kevin Barnes, 3rd round- 4 games, 2 tackles

Asher Allen, 3rd round- 10 games, 27 tackles, 1 pick.

 

I don't think it's fair to say he played like a sixth round pick and proved no one wrong.

 

 

 

PurpleStuff

May 10th, 2010 at 7:16 PM ^

The Bengals were so pleased with his performance that they drafted another corner (Brandon Ghee) in the third round this year and signed one of the worst behaved players in the history of professional sports to come in and play corner for them as well.  They don't appear to be overly enamored with Trent's play and his stats are unimpressive for someone who got such significant playing time (it is unclear how much any of these players you list got to actually see the field outside of special teams duty).  Acting like he is significantly better than a 6th round pick (which is his contention, mind you, not yours or anyone else's here) ignores every opportunity he has had to prove himself on the football field throughout his college and pro career.

BlueintheLou

May 10th, 2010 at 6:26 PM ^

I continue to fail to understand why people keep using Trent's NFL career to make a proxy scouting for him going into the NFL. YOU CAN'T. Rodriguez did not have the ability to see into the future and what he might do. All he could do was use the present, and the present was a less than stellar cornerback who did not work hard or buy into the program. Can't fault Rodriguez for giving a less than stellar review of Trent, if he indeed did.

PurpleStuff

May 10th, 2010 at 6:01 PM ^

Plenty of people have posted here saying Carr should not be criticized for making statements when the only evidence of those statements is this poorly sourced article/book.  That line of thinking would be correct if that is what Brian did.  He didn't. 

A former player has claimed in a very public forum that Coach Carr told him that RR essentially badmouthed him to NFL scouts.  As others have pointed out, having the public perceive that the UM head coach is the kind of guy to do that is a PR disaster with respect to recruiting talented athletes (the lifeblood of any college football program).

Either Coach Carr said this to Trent or he didn't (regardless of whether RR did anything of the sort).  If he said this to Trent on the basis of either third party accounts or his own invention (since I sincerely doubt he directly overheard Rodriguez badmouthing Trent to scouts) his actions directly undermine the future success of the Michigan football program.  If he didn't say it, he has a responsibility as an employee of the University of Michigan athletic department to correct any public misperception about his comments that would serve to undermine the future success of the football program (How many recruits have expressed concern about RR's institutional support and job security as their sole doubt about committing to play at Michigan?).  He has not done that.  This isn't a matter of dignifying rumor with a response.  A former player has essentially claimed out in the open (in parralel to what is going on between RR and Trent) that Lloyd Carr has been badmouthing RR to people who played under both coaches.  If he did that, he needs to stand by his statements and (I think) should promptly be fired from the athletic department.  If he didn't, he needs to clarify things publicly so that there is no confusion about his commitment to the ongoing success of the Michigan football program.  Since he hasn't done that, he deserves to be criticized until such time as he puts an end to this issue.

You don't have to assume Carr made these statements in order to be critical of him in this situation.  He is equally to blame if he didn't make the statements but fails to distance himself publicly from the harmful allegations/claims made by Trent and the author, especially in light of the fact that he is still an AD employee.

PurpleStuff

May 10th, 2010 at 7:08 PM ^

Assuming he did not directly hear Rodriguez doing this (which I can't imagine he did) and he failed to make any attempt to discuss the situation with Rodriguez before passing it along to Trent, he was doing nothing but spreading rumors that negatively impact the current coach and the program (especially now that they have become public).  I don't think any employee of the athletic department should be engaged in that kind of behavior.

Magnus

May 10th, 2010 at 7:26 PM ^

Wow . . . you're going to fire an ex-coach because he told one of his former players that the current coach badmouthed the player to his potential employers.  That is beyond ridiculous.

If Coach Carr had allegedly said that Rodriguez should be fired or something like that, I'd agree.  But you can't fault the guy for being honest with a player who he recruited and coached for four years.  Besides that, it sounds like Morgan Trent told the journalist without Carr's blessing; Trent went to Carr afterward and told him that those comments would be in the book.  So you'd be firing Carr because Morgan Trent has a big mouth.

Wow.  Just wow.

PurpleStuff

May 10th, 2010 at 7:35 PM ^

If Carr heard Rodriguez do it, then telling Trent out of respect for their prior coach/player relationship doesn't really bother me.  Being honest is one thing, passing along rumors from unnamed scouts/GM's without providing any background or context and without asking the person who is alleged to have done the badmouthing about it when those rumors cast the current coach (at the school that is paying his salary) in an extremely negative light is completely different.  I also have a bigger problem with Carr doing it in the first place than with the fact that Trent has gone out and told the world about it (again, assuming it happened as Trent has described in the first place). 

I think it is completely fair to hold all UM athletic department employees to the "don't spread rumors that could undermine the future success of the university's athletic programs" standard.  I also think allegations that the head football coach "badmouthed" former players to scouts/GM's meets this standard because it is the kind of thing that is very harmful to recruiting/perception.

Magnus

May 10th, 2010 at 8:17 PM ^

I don't know why your post started with "no."  You reiterated exactly what I said.

But anyway, let's set up a scenario.  I know this is purely hypothetical, but so is most of the speculation about this topic, since we have no idea how most of this stuff went down.

Let's say that after the draft or during the draft, Morgan Trent calls Lloyd Carr and says, "Coach, I have no idea why I dropped to the 6th round.  I thought I'd go in the 3rd or 4th round.  What made me drop this far?  I had great numbers at the Combine."  I would want and expect my former coach to be honest, share evaluations, and yes, tell me if somebody questioned my heart and work ethic.

How much of a fool would Morgan Trent be if he went back to Michigan and treated Rodriguez and treated him extremely well, when Rodriguez badmouthed him behind his back?  And how much of a fool would Morgan Trent feel like if the coach he trusted (Carr) withheld some very pertinent information about why he perhaps fell in the draft?

This goes both ways.  If Carr's not allowed to tell Trent what he heard, then Rodriguez should be obligated to tell players what he's going to relate to scouts.  Either way, Trent should be made aware of his shortcomings, whether it comes from a firsthand account (Rodriguez) or some other avenue.

MCalibur

May 10th, 2010 at 8:34 PM ^

Yeah Purp, this is a bit much. I have no doubt that Carr intended to have his comments stay private. That's why Trent had to go tell him about the quote. I said that Morgan burned 3 people (Rodriguez, the scout, Carr) in yesterday's thread. The collateral damage is only spreading now.

That said I also think that Carr is also allowing collateral damage to spread by maintaining radio silence. A word of support from him would help RR and Michigan immensely. He's not obligated to do that, but why wouldn't he want to help Michigan?

scwolverine

May 10th, 2010 at 6:57 PM ^

i cannot help but remember the photo of Bo and the 4 previous head coaches: Fritz Crisler, Bennie Oosterbaan, Harry Kipke and Bump Elliot.  Just think if Carr would have helped in the transition.  I do hold it against Carr.....he may not have said anything publicy against Rodriguez but he hasnt supported him either.

BlueGoM

May 10th, 2010 at 8:36 PM ^

You know, if Trent was as awful as everyone is saying, why is he in the pros?  If he was really as bad as some people are claiming, then he wouldn't have been drafted.   There were more problems with the defense in '08 than Morgan Trent  (cough, Shafer, cough).

Donovan Warren was our best corner last year, correct?  Not drafted. 

Just sayin'.

oldcityblue

May 10th, 2010 at 9:49 PM ^

and amazed at the amount of speculative, passive-aggressive nonsense that this has generated.

These men are going to have to deal with a good amount of regret once this is over. Mostly, I worry about resentment. If RR is successful or not, he will have to deal with a lot of resentment. Same goes for LLoyd, as there is nothing here to be proud of.

Mayby when Morgan Trent grows up a bit, he will see that his self-serving ways are not the stuff of which Michigan Men are made.

dex

May 10th, 2010 at 9:53 PM ^

but there is a response to this bullshit, not just this article in particular, at wla that i'd rather not re-post here in its entirety. 

chitownblue2

May 10th, 2010 at 11:20 PM ^

Yes, dex is a troll who:

a) has moderated upwards of 9 CIL's on this website.

b) has authored 3 posts for this website when Brian was on vacation

c) is a moderator on this board

Huge fucking troll, that dex.

If you can't handle someone disagreeing with Brian's opinion (which, I can guarantee you, Brian can), you need to grow the fuck up.

rick55

May 10th, 2010 at 11:25 PM ^

I only replied to Dex's post because it was on the front page of the comments. As a matter of fact, I liked his post at the WLA today. I didn't post the clip because I disagreed with dex, I did it because I thought the clip is almost as stupid as this whole god damned thing has been.

jb

May 10th, 2010 at 10:08 PM ^

Rich Rod tells a future employer that a player is lazy.  Any boss would do this in a business setting if he thought employee A was a piece of crap.  RR told it like it was - in his opinion.  Why should he stick up for a kid who didn't do all he could for RR's program.  Maybe the kid should have worked harder and been a better leader.  Then he might have gotten a better review.  I'm sure there are tons of cases of players getting badmouthed about their attitudes to NFL scouts.  Carr shouldn't have said anything - it's no longer his place for that B.S.  Keep your 2 cents to yourself. 

Good luck to Morgan in the future.  Let's hope he doesn't run into MIke Williams or any other former USC receiver ever again.  He might get 3rd degree burns.

JB

Magnus

May 10th, 2010 at 10:30 PM ^

"Good luck to Morgan in the future.  Let's hope he doesn't run into MIke Williams or any other former USC receiver ever again.  He might get 3rd degree burns."

That's hilarious, dude.  Hey, while we're at it, let's bash every Michigan player who got torched by USC's juggernaut of the 2000s.  I hope Leon Hall doesn't run into any former USC receivers, either!  I hope Jake Long never has to play against any former USC defensive linemen!  I hope Chad Henne never has to throw passes against any former USC defenders!

Haha Leon Hall sux cuz he got beat by USC! 

chitownblue2

May 10th, 2010 at 11:33 PM ^

It makes me extremely to sad to think that this is the current opinion of Lloyd Carr here, given that many here will merely accept, and parrot these talking points.

In my handful of experiences with the man, Carr was a good, gracious, and kind man - one who would never trash a kid, or anyone, to anybody. If Carr did say something approaching this to Trent, he did it to protect one of "his" kids - and his kids came before ANYTHING to him. That's why any person who EVER played for him will vouch for him until they're blue in the face.

Car has done, and continues to do, more for Michigan athletics than all but a scant handful of people in the history of the school, and to think he is doing anything to "betray" Michigan is offensive, and borderline absurd. You may disagree with what "being true" to Michigan is, but to think his intention is anything else is turning a blind eye to his history.

Is Carr a Michigan Man? Carr proved he was a Michigan Man as an assistant for fourteen years, and the head coach for twelve, bringing the school it's only National Championship in the modern era. He proved he was a Michigan Man when he raised probably more money for Mott Children's Hospital than anyone walking this earth, and he proved he was a Michigan Man when he sat with a friend of mine whom he had never met for more than an hour as they were undergoing Chemo all because he received an e-mail about her situation.

Most of us on this board, including myself, not only couldn't, but hardly deserve to compare the amount of good we've done for others with Mr. Carr. And his thanks is character assassination during his retirement.

Bravo, all.