I want to know if our current players were quoted in this context, too. I have to think some of the current players said this during media day, right around the start of camp.
Jihad The Second: Stop Bringing Up Maxwell
This defense meme has been all of the internet yesterday and today, but it must be debunked. Here's freshman MSU QB Andrew Maxwell:
We're almost a full week into it and preseason camp is everything all of us freshmen expected it to be: learning a completely new style of football, working hard every day to try and move our way up the depth chart, meeting new people and trying to fit in with the flow of things, and trying to get used to this totally foreign schedule. A typical day consists of showing up for meetings as early as 7:30 a.m. and being dismissed after our final meeting at 9:30 p.m. In those 14 hours, we have meetings, practice, lunch, more meetings, film sessions, dinner and meetings.
OMG! OMG! OM—
18.104.22.168.5 Preseason Practice. Daily and weekly hour limitations do not apply to countable athletically related activities occurring during preseason practice prior to the first day of classes or the first scheduled contest, whichever is earlier.
Aw, hamburgers. Practice limits don't count during fall camp. You can stop bringing this up now.
Not that this prevented Michigan State from deleting that article in its entirety from its website. Here's an archived copy.
True...wasn't it FRESHMEN who were quoted by name? Guys who haven't played a season yet at U-M...who may have enrolled in January, or moved to AA in June?
And yeah, their quotes, if not part of an official "interview" (complete with introduction of who the reporter is, what the interview is about, etc.) then falls well outside of standard journalistic ethics (wifey is an ethical journo, fwiw).
Exactly. Exactly. That renders the Rosenberg article in the EXACT same light.
Yeah, but like I said in the board thread: Rosenberg made a huge stinking fuss about what our freshmen said and how they "apparently didn't know the rules." I hated the way they were treated before and I absolutely despise it now. Abhor, condemn, detest, whatever. If practice limits don't count during fall camp, then Rosenberg is the one who doesn't know the rules and he had no fucking business throwing Stokes and Hawthorne under the bus and claiming they were the ignorant ones. So while the article doesn't open up MSU to the same accusations as us, it's still perfectly relevant and useful for debunking Rosenberg's horseshit.
But, it seems like the more I become aware of the rules, the only thing that worries me now is the Sunday thing.
Which, as has been pointed out, includes so much gray area, that you know a coach as experienced as Rodriguez has it all covered.
For example, I spent most of yesterday worrying about Barwis' future because it was clear that either he or members of his staff were at some of those voluntaries. The Freep article stressed only trainers could attend.
Of course, you read the rulebook and S/C are allowed to be there and it just so happens our kids happen to address them as coach.
I just wish the writers for the Freep had taken the time to learn the rules better and portray a more true account of what the rules were in their story.
The thing that worries me is having punishments from coaching staff for missing summer workouts. Because then it's tough to argue the voluntary side of the mandatory/voluntary gray area.
In this regard, Clemons comments are painful and make me wonder if we might get dinged in this regard:
So if the above Maxwell kid misses one of the voluntary 14-hour day practices, he wont have to to do sprints or anything?
If the rules dont cover those summer workouts, then it does not matter if Barwis made the kids do extra the day after they skipped.
Folks, I am an Irish fan and ND alum. I think it's time for schools like Michigan, Notre Dame, Penn State, Northwestern, Stanford, and other academically minded D-1 schools to circle the wagons. I attended Notre Dame in the 1980s. We never hated Michigan. In fact we liked the football rivalry because it was like playing your brother. Players at Notre Dame and Michigan played ball, but still had to attend class, mixed with the student body as one of us, and all of us were trying to achieve. At ND we hated schools that cheated like Miami. We had no respect for schools that had football for non-students, or worse, reformatory dropouts. Pitt was an example of this for about 10 years.
But things for D-1 football have gotten out of hand. The assumed link between the better player and money for the school has put too much pressure on the system. Arguments once were made that we owe it to the underpriviledged to bring them to campus, if only on athleic merits, so they may get degreee. The problem is, in many cases, they are not prepared to sit in a college classrom. Moreover, the promise of at least giving them a chance at huge sums of money via the NFL is a hollow promise. The majority of NFL players go bankrupt by the time they are 40.
And the NCAA has also shown clear indications of corruption and serving it's own greed. Why are some investigations pursued with vigor, while others are quitely delayed? Why do we give scholarships to these underprivilidged, only to threaten sanctions if someone buys a poor player a meal, ( No stipend for pocket change allowed )?
I suggest that loyal alums and fans of what universities like Michigan and Notre Dame represent would watch in great numbers even true limits were put on the programs. Some would say, " NO way, we couldn't compete!" I say form a new division that honors top athletes who also can attend college legitamately. Put true limits on what a program is allowed to do, such as practice time. Get enough teams, especially the traditional schools, and the fan fervor will be as high, maybe higher. Let those who think college football is merley to have a team to root for, go find a pro team. Let the schools who don't truly care about world class education fall away. Some of us want 1st rate Universities and a 1st world nation. That means for ALL students.
One blogger said he didn't want Michigan to go the way of Notre Dame. I think true Michigan alums, folks who are Michigan people, not Detroit Lions fans looking for a winner; those folks DO want Michigan to STAY like Notre Dame. Notice I didn't say go the way of Notre Dame. Michigan has always been an honorable school. It might seem strage, but this immediate problem exposes not Michigan, but the NCAA. Again I say, let's join the Michigan's, Notre Dame's, Stanford's, Northwestern's, Penn State's, Vanderbilt's, Ivy Leagues, and any others who want exciting football, played by clean honrable programs. We can afford to lose the NCAA much more than they can afford to lose us.
Go Blue and Go Irish!
You had some good things to say, and it's clear that you love your school for the right reasons. I don't agree with all of your points, but you had my attention.
Right up until you said "Go Blue and Go Irish!" That kinda tasted like bad fruit.
"blah blah blah, I'm a stupid domer"
Well said my Irish friend... Well said...
Story just went front page on YAHOO
Link is to Dr. Saturday, but the Yahoo headline is plenty misleading...
Let's play the games. Let all our extra practice show and play w/ a vengence. RR will have no mercy on our opponents and run the score up as high as possible. Is it saturday yet?
Maxwell's written two diaries so far for the MSU website. Both also appeared in his hometown Midland Daily News. The first one included the reference to 14-hour days. It has disappeared from the Midland Daily News website, while the second diary is still available online (http://www.ourmidland.com/articles/2009/08/25/sports/2045800.txt).
So MSU not only scrubbed the article from their own website; they also got a newspaper to scrub it from its website.
Which makes the Stokes and Hawthorne quotes moot, right? I mean if Rosenberg used two true freshmen's quotes, the only time they could've been referencing is this past summer. I still see a double standard in all of this.
Funny that link says that it no longer exists! Brain did you get a screen shot. I really want to email to the FREE PRESS editor and see what he thinks. I think that this whole situation is the biggest pile of BULLSHIT I have seen in a long time. I hope this shit blows up in his face and he is told to clean out his desk and go somewhere else. It won't happen but I can dream cant I?
"Funny that link says that it no longer exists! Brain did you get a screen shot."
Did you actually... read this post?
Brian, you're still kind of dancing around three central points:
*Anything resembling that much of a workout, on Sundays, is a violation. NFL teams don't lift weights on days after games.
*Your beloved Angelique, at the News, confirms that M exceeded the hours permitted according to NCAA rules.
*Just because Other Teams Do It doesn't make it right, especially at M, a school with a reputation for doing things the right way.
Don't get me wrong: you're awesome and invaluable. But since you largely always take the RR line, and here seem disinclined to accept any part of the Freep story, you too should be view skeptically. Sometimes, at least. Admit it. Inasmuch as Rosenberg may or may not have an Agenda -- and I'm not sure that's entirely true, BTW -- you don't really pretend to view M with anything like true objectivity. You've become something of a de facto news-source, so...
Just saying for all those who reflexively take every word you say as The Undisputable Truth. Obviously, I read you for a reason too. But let's take a breath here.
Have you read Rosenberg's work on Michigan football lately. This latest thing hardly exists in a vacuum. Agreed, the article can still be read for the facts it purports to contain -- but between the anonymous sources and the obvious questions left unasked/unanswered, how much factual content were you able to get out of it? I sure didn't see much.
Actually Maxwell's articles are still up on the MSU website. Since the article with the relevant quote is two weeks old, it's been moved to the archived "News" area. Here's the link: