If You Pretend You Are A Statue Do Not Be Surprised When You Erode Comment Count

Brian

Oblig coach obit. Don't get on my case, man.

Hoke-Rain-2[1]

I mean, he gave Penn State a free shot at the endzone by taking a timeout with three seconds left in the first half.

What do you do with that? How do you put that into your ongoing calculations? Add that datum to the rickety mess that is your ever-shifting, often-hypocritical, prone-to-explode model of your favorite thing in the world, and what happens? I don't know. The brain elects not to travel down that path. The future ceases to exist, replaced by only the ever more nonsensical present. All series diverge. Projection is impossible.

Let's jam that thing in anyway.

5T5IB[1]

Not an improvement, but not any worse either. At that point such a thing was almost expected, after the previous year's offensive line roulette and 27 for 27 and two minute drills that usually took five minutes. Time for some maniacal giggling, then.

On the bright side, even three-and-a-half years deep into a coaching tenure that resembled nothing so much as Wile E. Coyote sauntering off a cliff Brady Hoke still had ways to surprise you.

hokeecoyote[4]

via Seth

-------------------------------------------------

Brady Hoke should never have been Michigan's football coach. This was apparent from the start, as at the time of his hire he had two assets: the fool's gold of an undefeated MAC regular season and a reasonable, if truncated, turnaround job at San Diego State. Aside from that he had five seasons of average MAC ball and zero years as a coordinator. Even the breakout year at Ball State ended with consecutive blowout losses to Buffalo and Tulsa.

When you stake your program to a resume like that you're as likely as not to come out the other end with Tim Beckman or Tim Brewster or Darrell Hazell. An infinite number of nondescript gentleman have had the ball bounce the right way during the furball that is a season in the Mid-American. Some of them populate the lower rungs of the Big Ten when Purdue can't think of anything better.

And then there's Bo.

Bo was on another level, having gone 27-8-1 in league play in six years with Miami. Even he was widely derided. Here is that picture again.

bl006724[1]

In the center is a man who has made a Decision. It's no exaggeration to say that Michigan's best and… most recent athletic directors staked their careers on whether they could separate coaching talent from noise.

All these years later, you get why Canham rolled the dice on Bo. Bo was a legendary hardass who took nothing from anyone and comfortably existed atop the roiling mass of chaos that is any football program, successful or not. He chewed out players on the sidelines, sent them back in the game, and cracked impish smiles at the reaming he'd just handed to the young man. He has a gravitas that stays with the program—veritably looms—a decade after his death. Bo had the proverbial It, and you can understand how he communicated that to Canham in whatever passed for a job interview between them.

That understanding will permanently elude historians attempting to discern what comparable force of personality Brady Hoke brought to a press conference in the Junge Center in January 2011.

-----------------------------------

There was a moment, though. Now it's hard to remember that Brady Hoke had two years in which it seemed he was indeed gold that does not glitter. Hoke gruffly intoned "This Is Michigan, fergodsakes" in response to a question nobody remembers. He wore short sleeves in weather ranging from torrid to frozen. His matter-of-fact declarations and tough toughness were his tentpoles. We hung a great edifice of hope on it; Hoke going to and winning a BCS game in year one provided buttresses and filigree and whatnot to the structure.

At a few years remove it's clear that Hoke stumbled ass-backwards into that success. Few 11-2 seasons have been jankier than Michigan's 2011. The Notre Dame game that kicked things off was a deranged exercise in winning against double coverage; Michigan threw 41 times for 2.8 YPA against Michigan State; they had 166 yards of offense before chuck-and-pray time against Iowa; they were one overthrown Braxton Miller pass away from losing to a .500 OSU team; they won that bowl game with 184 yards of total offense.

The signs were all there, even in the moment ("lucky as hell," quoth this space in the aftermath of the Denard After Dentist game). I alternated between excitement at the idea of a head coach who had an innate aggressiveness on fourth down and wondering why the hell they thought Denard Robinson could be Tom Brady.

But the games were won, and the recruits rolled in. Hoke seemed to stroll through a garden of four-stars gathering what he would. For a year or two, everything seemed just fine. In 2013, Michigan beat Notre Dame rather easily. Michigan fans were walking on air. Then someone looked down.

----------------------------

Rarely in the history of college football has a fanbase been jerked so rudely to attention as already beleaguered Michigan fans were in 2013. The relatively straight line that was the Hoke era turned into a harrowing plunge straight into the bowels of second-and-eleven-play-action hell. Save for an inexplicable Ohio State game, Michigan became the most brutally unwatchable team in the country the instant they left the field against Notre Dame.

Hoke was the same person through the good bits and the bad. He was gruffly nonsensical to start and gruffly nonsensical to end. As success turned to failure, the things we liked about him became the things we hated about him. Remember when this was hilarious?

via Ace

That joke isn't funny anymore.

Despite the fact that people will still swear up and down that Brady Hoke is a great dude, I have less charity in my heart for him than I did Rich Rodriguez when it came to write his obit. A slice from that piece:

Coaches aren't humans. They are walking soundbites wrapped in great swirling cloaks of mythology. Rap on one of their chests. You will get a hollow clang and a statement about senior leadership. Kick sand in one of their faces. You will get a lecture from Peter the Great. Peter the Great will be confused and incensed that he cannot sentence you to hang. Tell one his aunt has been dismembered by bikers on PCP and you will get a statement about senior leadership. Seniors don't do PCP and rip aunts limb from limb, because they have leadership.

Rodriguez was human. He was just this guy. He wasn't supernatural or metallic. If you rapped his chest he would probably get a little weepy. He did not seem like a great leader of men, or a colossus astride anything, or even a dude fully in control of his shit.

Hoke was that coachbot even in impossible circumstances. By the end so many indignities had piled up that I was waiting for him to snap.

It never came. He endured the brutally painful press conference following last year's Minnesota game as a coachbot. He released a statement apologizing to Michigan State for Joe Bolden putting a small piece of metal in their field. At no point did he bite the head off a reporter, or say that his boss had sold him down the river, or do anything at all other than repeat the same goddamn things he'd been repeating for two straight years.

I liked Rodriguez because he seemed like a person who reacted to stimuli. He reacted too much, but at least you could see that he was processing information and coming to conclusions about what it meant.

Hoke did not do this. Whether Hoke was stoic or insensate is in the eye of the beholder; given the chaos around the program my vote is the latter. He seemed to shut down in terror when his dream job turned to a nightmare.

As the competence of his team deteriorated, Hoke shuffled his coaching staff nonsensically instead of making real changes. He stuck with his terrible punt formation and a style of offense unsuited for his quarterbacks. Even after it was clear his disastrous program could not be allowed to continue—the financial ruin it would cause must have been apparent to even Michigan's most recent athletic director—nothing changed. If Hoke thought he had a chance, well, he also called timeout to give Penn State a free Hail Mary.

At least Nero fiddled. Brady Hoke stood there in the rain without so much as shaking a fist at the heavens.

Comments

raleighwood

August 6th, 2015 at 1:59 PM ^

Justin Boren (2nd Team All B1G in 2007), Stephen Schilling (NFL), Jeremy Ciulla, Alex Mitchell, Perry Dorrenstein, Mark Huyge, David Molk (NFL), David Moosman, Mark Ortmann and Cory Zirbel were all available to RR in 2008.  Not all of them stayed....but all were available when he took over the roster.  Surely a middle of the road B1G OL could have been formed out that group.

Michael Cox (NFL), Carlos Brown and Brandon Minor were at least average B1G RB's.

Junior Hemingway (NFL), Greg Mathews were reasonable WR's and you can throw Roundtree and Stonum into the mix as true freshman.

QB is where the issue arises.  Obviously, Ryan Mallett (NFL) was on the roster when RR took over.  Does anyone know the true reasons he left?  Some say it was a "done deal", but do you really think he's jumping ship if Les Miles had been named HC?  Steven Threet was a four star RS-Freshman who went on the start at ASU before injuries cut his career short.  So yeah, I'm saying that Threet could have been more effective in a pro-style offense than his slow-footed self was in running the zone read.

Michigan hadn't had a losing season since the 1960's!  Going 3-9 in 2008 was not inevitable.  Michigan could have (should have) beaten Utah, Toledo (that's right, Toledo) Purdue and Northwestern that year.  Going 7-5 would have gone a long way in helping RR in the long run.

Yeoman

August 6th, 2015 at 5:18 PM ^

When Carr called a player to his office and dropped the transfer papers on the desk, there was a reason. When said player responded, eventually, by transferring, it's possible that it wasn't for the worst.

It may be hard to remember now, but there was a time in there when Carr and Rodriguez were seen in public together and were clearly on speaking terms. RR's application for the job had been at Carr's suggestion, after all.

I'd be shocked if they didn't discuss the Mallett situation then. Maybe I'm wrong, but it was my strong belief at the time, and nothing ever happened later to shake it, that Rodriguez made an informed decision not to chase too hard after Mallett based on what he heard from Lloyd. I can't imagine Carr making a recommendation, but I can easily imagine a frank discussion that left RR thinking "nope, that's not something I want to deal with."

Sometimes you have to base a decision on the longer-term health of the program--Beilein's handling of the basketball program is instructive here--and if it means a couple of extra losses in the present, so be it. I've been one of Rodriguez's most vehement critics around here and especially regarding his handling of personnel, but that's one I don't hold against him AT ALL.

Pinky

August 6th, 2015 at 12:59 PM ^

So in your mind, it was preferable for Rodriguez to maybe win 2-3 more games in 2008 with a QB that everyone knew would be gone in one year than to implement his new offensive system for the rest of the roster?  How would that have made things any better?

Mich OC

August 6th, 2015 at 9:04 PM ^

That is an incredibly myopic approach.  By delaying implementing your system, you are basically putting off the painful year until the next year.  In year 2, he would be implementing a full new system with a new QB.  

What difference is 5-7 to 3-9 if the 3-9 year sets you up better for the future?

 

robpollard

August 6th, 2015 at 1:02 PM ^

I'm going to need some evidence for this claim. I'll take NFL draft position ; how they did once they transfered. Anything.

I recently watched the UM-Wisky game (one of the few "highlights" from that year). I forgot how bad our offense was (or blocked it from memory). The plays were often there to be made* -- people would pop open, but Threet would regularly over/under throw them, or just not see them. The OL wasn't much better.

It's not Threet's fault. He was a RS Fr and would have made an excellent backup later in his career. But a "workable offensive system" with no QB and no OL does not exist.

* It's funny, in 2008, everyone was afraid of this new-fangled spread football. Now looking at it, you see the plays and you're like, "This looks like a typical 2015 offensive scheme." 

Yeoman

August 6th, 2015 at 6:23 PM ^

...so let's do it and see what we find. Draft positions is the easiest--I'll pull up the drafts from 2009 to 2012 and see how many were drafted from each B1G school, by round. To make it easier I'm going by school drafted from, which will miss the transfers. You can eyeball the Malletts back in if you like.

I'm including supplemental draft players like Pryor, in the draft position the team forfeited the following year.

The teams are in the order of the first player taken from the team in that draft. I'll also mention notable players that went undrafted but have had decent pro careers.

2009:

  • Penn St. 1/0/2/1/0/0/1
  • Ohio St. 1/2/0/2/1/0/0
  • Illinois 1/0/0/0/1/1/0
  • Iowa 0/0/2/1/0/1/0
  • Purdue 0/0/1/0/0/1/0
  • Wisconsin 0/0/4/0/0/0/0
  • Michigan 0/0/0/1/0/1/0
  • Michigan St. 0/0/0/0/1/0/0

Undrafted: Brian Hoyer, Jonathan Casillas, Alex Boone.

2010:

  • Michigan 1/0/0/0/1/0/1
  • Iowa 1/1/2/1/0/0/1
  • Penn St. 1/1/1/0/1/0/2
  • Indiana 0/1/0/0/0/0/2
  • Illinois 0/1/1/0/1/0/1
  • Purdue 0/1/0/0/0/0/0
  • Minnesota 0/0/1/0/1/0/0
  • Northwestern 0/0/0/2/1/0/0/0
  • Ohio St. 0/0/0/1/0/0/3
  • Wisconsin 0/0/0/2/0/0/0
  • Michigan St. 0/0/0/0/0/0/1

Undrafted: Jeff Cumberland

2011:

  • Wisconsin 2/1/1/0/0/0/1
  • Purdue 1/0/0/0/0/0/0
  • Illinois 1/1/1/0/0/0/1
  • Iowa 1/0/0/1/3/1/0
  • Ohio St. 1/0/1/1/1/2/0
  • Penn St. 0/1/0/0/0/1/0
  • Michigan 0/1/0/0/0/1/0
  • Indiana 0/0/0/2/0/0/0
  • Michigan St. 0/0/0/0/0/2/0

Undrafted: can't think of anybody.

2012 (admittedly this might include some players still in HS in '08):

  • Iowa 1/0/0/1/2/1/1
  • Illinois 2/2/0/0/0/0/0
  • Wisconsin 1/1/1/1/1/1/0
  • Michigan St. 0/1/0/2/0/2/1
  • Penn St. 0/1/0/0/2/0/1
  • Ohio St. 0/1/1/0/0/2/0
  • Michigan 0/0/1/0/0/0/2
  • Purdue 0/0/0/0/1/1/0
  • Northwestern 0/0/0/0/0/0/2

Undrafted: nobody of note.

Total drafted over the four years:

  1. Iowa 22
  2. Ohio State 20
  3. Penn State 17
  4. Wisconsin 17
  5. Illinois 15
  6. Michigan 10
  7. Michigan State 10
  8. Purdue 6
  9. Indiana 5
  10. Northwestern 5
  11. Minnesota 2

Drafted in the first three rounds:

  1. Wisconsin 11
  2. Illinois 10
  3. Iowa 8
  4. Penn State 8
  5. Ohio State 7
  6. Michigan 3
  7. Purdue 3
  8. Indiana 1
  9. Michigan State 1
  10. Minnesota 1
  11. Northwestern 0

First round picks:

  1. Illinois 4
  2. Iowa 3
  3. Wisconsin 3
  4. Ohio State 2
  5. Penn State 2
  6. Michigan 1
  7. Purdue 1

Tied for 6/7 each time--not literally "better than half the teams in the conference", but close.

(And isn't it amazing that Illinois, with four future first-round picks and ten in the top three rounds, went 5-7 while Michigan State and Northwestern went 9-4? Minnesota somehow managed a bowl appearance as well, with only two future draft picks on their entire roster.)

PurpleStuff

August 6th, 2015 at 12:53 PM ^

Denard was the reigning B1G player of the year.  Threet was a RS freshman that transferred 6 months later (and would have been beaten out by both Tate and Denard in camp) whose best season as a collegiate QB saw him throw 18 TD and 16 INT. 

And are we really pretending Hoke had a "system"?  His offense at SDSU was very different from the one he had success with at Ball State, and he completely switched his offensive (new coordinator, much more zone blocking) and defensive schemes (over/under switch and emphasis on press coverage to try and steal MSU's thunder) going into his fourth year here.  Lining up in the I and running power so guys who weren't going to be here down the road could practice it for a coordinator that ended up getting fired anyway was not a smart decision.

Durham Blue

August 6th, 2015 at 2:50 PM ^

I, for the record (and if it really matters anyway), was fully on board with implementing the spread back in 2008.  It sounds like I'm in the minority but I thought every game in that 3-9 season was interesting and fun to watch.  It was so weird seeing Michigan run that type of offense but it definitely kept me glued to the TV.  IDK, I liked the RR era and really wish it would've turned out better.  But I'm not complaining about our current coach...obviously.

Also, for the record, I follow Arizona pretty closely now.  So at least I'm consistent.

enlightenedbum

August 6th, 2015 at 12:25 PM ^

Think about the trajectories.  Rodriguez's teams were improving (in that the offense was becoming a death machine and the defense was... well, still awful), but too slowly.  Hoke's teams got worse every year, and only started high because of the horseshoe firmly lodged up his ass in 2011.

SMart WolveFan

August 6th, 2015 at 1:27 PM ^

College football is about cycles, especially in terms of "returning starter" numbers.

RR came in and his transition plan was to "hold down the power button for 10 seconds" = full reset; IMO, he would have been smarter to hire an OC that was a pro set guru and run that the first year while working with his recruits on the spread behind the scenes. But, since he re-started the cycle, it wasn't untill the the last few years he was hitting his "high point". 

That was conversely what Hoke did well, he took advantage of being in the high point of RR recruiting cycle plus had Borges run the hybrid with "returning starters". Give him credit for the job he did that year even if the best part was staying out of the offenses way.

 

Hoke was not good enough in many areas to be the head coach at such a top program, especially on the offensive side of the ball, but the main problem is when you want to run man ball you need to run ball man. And in the Hoke era nobody ran ball but Denard.

Great thing here is Harbaugh gets Hoke's recruiting cycle high point with recruits that fit his system and they will get coached by one of the best coaching staffs in football today.

If RR and Hoke where the cost to get Harbaugh, I'm cool wit it.

 

M-Dog

August 6th, 2015 at 12:29 PM ^

Brian is a Spread enthusiast.  He was excited by the RichRod hire and disappointed that it did not work out.

He never liked the Hoke hire, and was especially skeptical about MANBALL.

He's holding his breath about Harbaugh's offense, not 100% sure exactly what it is going to be, and hoping that whatever it does turn out ot be . . . it just works.  

mGrowOld

August 6th, 2015 at 12:33 PM ^

At the Cleveland Alumni outing last year Brian showed exactly why Harbaugh's version of Manball will be so different (and more successful) than Hoke's and why he thinks it will work.  He showed all the different formation & blocking assignment changes that evolve from a simple two back, two TE set on a single play. He showed that there are elements of spread, I Form, you-name-it all encompassed in a Harbaugh offensive and that it was very, very difficult to stop.

Trust me - there was no holding his breath on the offense and he seemed VERY sure of what it was going to turn out to be.

MC5-95

August 6th, 2015 at 12:43 PM ^

Every Michigan fan should be disappointed that RichRod didn't work out. Because if he had worked out, we'd be--you know--winning and stuff. Anyone claiming otherwise years after the fact is just perpetuating the BS "Michigan Man" trope that got us saddled with Hoke.

sdogg1m

August 6th, 2015 at 1:02 PM ^

Is it not up to the coach to make it work? Michigan currently has a top 10 recruiting class following a losing season. What we have right now is a coach taking a position given and improving the situation. I have no doubt based on Harbaugh's ability to improve everything he can control that the team will improve during the season.

Rodriguez did not improve the team especially on the defensive side of the ball. There was no indication that he was going to be successful in the Big 10. The only reason why he went to a bowl game in year three was because he was undefeated prior to the Big 10. The season ended with a blowout in the bowl game. You don't continue to give a guy a chance who had won three games at best in the conference.

Dave Brandon did the right thing in firing Rich Rodriguez. He failed in hiring Brady Hoke.

I personally do not care at this point that Rodriguez has had one successful season at Arizona. Arizona is not Michigan. RichRod is nothing more than a system coach. He will lose his fair share of games and he will never win a national championship. I have no doubt he would not have won a Big 10 championship.

Zarniwoop

August 6th, 2015 at 1:16 PM ^

Rich Rod was a fucking disaster.

Hoke was much more successful, although still mostly shitty.

But, there is no history, revisionist or otherwise in which RR was a good coach here. Its great that he's moved on to a place where he can have success under a smaller microscope.  But, he could not make it work here. I don't believe for a moment that he ever could make it work here. He was just helpless and incompetent in his hires and recruiting.

I would 100 times rather live with Hoke than suffer through RR.

That said, I'm still in disbelief that Harbaugh is actually here.  Cannot wait for the next few years of football.

BluePhins

August 6th, 2015 at 1:48 PM ^

"I would 100 times rather live with Hoke than suffer through RR."

 

Yo, check out who the PAC-12 coach of the year was in the year 2014. Go to a website called google and (still using your keyboard) ask that question.

 

I sincerely hope I never have to have a conversation with you or anyone remotely like you. 

Mich OC

August 6th, 2015 at 9:09 PM ^

The difference is that Hoke's best year is with players he didn't recruit or develop, and he got steadily worse.  RR's best year is with players he recruited or had a significant hand in developing.  Year 3 success is much more indicative of coaching prowess than year 1 success.  

Yeoman

August 6th, 2015 at 9:22 PM ^

I don't recall this "Year 3 success." I remember a third year with yet another losing conference record, a 30-point shellacking at OSU, and finishing the year with three losses by an average score of 46-16. I remember a fortunate 7-6, with four of the seven wins by a touchdown or less but all six losses by double digits.

That was a bad team, one of the worst Michigan teams of my lifetime.

Yeoman

August 6th, 2015 at 9:01 PM ^

Hoke named Big Ten Coach of the Year

 

I think it's kind of funny, because Michigan 2011 and Arizona 2014 had a lot in common--they were seasons featuring a quite astonishing load of gold-pooping good luck. Narrow wins over a couple of bad non-conference opponents. Down 15 to Cal with five minutes to play, come back to win. Get to play Oregon without three of their starting offensive linemen. Washington could take a knee and win, but they decide to run a play, fumble, and lose.

It's all fun while it's happening, but at some point you have to recognize that you aren't as good as your record might make you think.

westwardwolverine

August 6th, 2015 at 2:37 PM ^

The only reasons Hoke had more success than Rodriguez boils down to him inheriting a better team and being allowed to hire the DC he wanted. If Rodriguez had walked into the 2011 team with Casteel in tow, I dunno if we lose a game these past four years. 

MC5-95

August 6th, 2015 at 12:36 PM ^

You should change a system to match the strengths of your good / great players, like Denard. Threet is not someone you change your system for. Pro style Threet would have resulted in possibly worse results than spread Threet. I would think that this would be obvious.

saveferris

August 6th, 2015 at 12:50 PM ^

The difference being that Rodriguez took over a team that was much more depleted than the one Hoke took over. Let's assume Rich decides to modify his offense to fit the personnel a little better, how good is Michigan then? 5-7? 6-6? 7-5? The bottom line is that 2008 squad wasn't going to be particularly good regardless, so the fanbase turns all ornery regardless. We can't look back through the lenses of hindsight and tell ourselves we'd have been satisfied with 7-5 because we avoided being 3-9. I think Rodriguez assessed the situation in that first season and determined that his quickest path to success was to get his team playing football proficiently his way as soon as possible, regardless of the short-term pain that would bring.
when both were left with unstable rosters and a system that didn't fit their players.
This statement is somewhat inaccurate. Hoke took over a heavily upperclass-laden team with exceptional senior leaders. Granted, Hoke and Borges had to tweak their offensive gameplan to adjust to their personnel, but they at least had personnel that made the tweaking worthwhile. Trying to imply equivalency in the personnel situation between Rodriguez Year One and Hoke Year One is intellectually dishonest. Rodriguez may not be a great football coach, but he is certainly a very good football coach given the results he’s had at every other program he’s lead. The same can’t be said for Brady Hoke.

Wolverine 73

August 6th, 2015 at 1:40 PM ^

Hoke took over a team with some solid seniors, BUT with almost nothing in the underclass offensive pipeline other than slot receivers (obviously an exaggeration).  In Hoke's defense, the woeful OL recruiting by RR played a large part in the slide from season one, not that Hoke's horrible coaching wasn't also a major factor in that.  Hey, they both sucked at Michigan, and whatever either has done or may do elsewhere is really of no concern to me.  Hail Harbaugh, who has yet to suffer a loss as M coach!

wesq

August 6th, 2015 at 12:57 PM ^

RR has shown over his entire career to be a good coach, not great. Hoke has a career that says mediocre. The program was headed in those directions when they were fired. 110,000 come out every week to experience great neither would've or should've survived long term.

DoubleB

August 6th, 2015 at 6:18 PM ^

is a top of the line offensive coordinator who's mediocre at being a head coach. He can get away with it at smaller schools like WVU and Arizona. Michigan was the very definition of bad fit.

Brady Hoke is a very good DL coach who's also mediocre at being a head coach, although in different ways that RichRod. Again, Michigan was not a very good fit.

Harbaugh is a very good head coach and possibly an all-timer. He's not RR as a coordinator and I'm not as convinced as everyone else he's this great QB coach. But who cares. That's not his job. His job is to be the leader and face of the Michigan football program to both the outside world and within the program. And more than anyone else Michigan could have gotten, he understands that.

93Grad

August 6th, 2015 at 1:09 PM ^

what are you expecting from Harbaugh?  RR has had far more success as a college coach than Harbaugh.  Of course he has had more opportunities, but you cannot dismiss what RR did at WVU and now at Arizona just because it did not work here.

saveferris

August 6th, 2015 at 1:41 PM ^

 

Of course he has had more opportunities, but you cannot dismiss what RR did at WVU and now at Arizona just because it did not work here.

 

Well, you shouldn't dismiss what RR did at WVU and Arizona, but as we've seen all too often around here when this topic comes up; posters have no trouble doing just that.

MileHighWolverine

August 6th, 2015 at 2:52 PM ^

@ak47 - because given what RRod had to work with in Threet and Sherridammit, it made sense to go ahead and push the transition as fast as possible so a future suitable QB could come in and operate the preferred "Offensive System" asap. Hoke had Denard coming into his second year as a starter when he had just lit up the B10 the prior year. Shifting away from the style that made Denard electric and dangerous made no sense whatsoever. 

gbdub

August 6th, 2015 at 3:02 PM ^

RR adapting better to Threet makes us maybe 6-6, at best.

Hoke adapting better to Denard gives us at least one B1G championship in 2011 or 2012.

Not all wins are created equal.

Also our run game, the part RR is known for, was actually decent in 2008 on a YPC basis, as I recall.



Sent from MGoBlog HD for iPhone & iPad

MGoClimb

August 6th, 2015 at 12:20 PM ^

I remember the 2010 coaching search, and having Harbaugh and Miles at the top of my list. I was disappointed when Hoke was hired. But at his introductory press conference he said all of the things I wanted to hear. What we all wanted to hear.

I wanted him to do well at Michigan, even though deep down I thought he was in over his head. In the end, both Michigan and Hoke are in better places now.

 

saveferris

August 6th, 2015 at 12:58 PM ^

Firing Rich Rodriguez after 3 seasons in favor of Brady Hoke made no sense then and makes even less sense now.  You could have given Rich Rod a 4th year to see if the team's trajectory of improvement was going to continue and if the results were unsatisfactory, Brady Hoke would've still been around to hire in 2012.

Needs

August 6th, 2015 at 1:25 PM ^

Firing Rich Rod was the right decision at the time. Hiring him was also the right decision, but neither he nor Martin managed the problems of program transition in what had become a schlerotic program after almost 30 years without a deep seated overhaul.

 

But by the end of 2010, it seemed clear that the team had quit on him (the Wisconsin/Ohio State/Mississippi State games) and that he had no real ideas of how to fix the defense. It would have been malpractice for any high school coach to recommend that a highly rated defensive player go to Michigan at that point. Also, the "improvement" of 2010 was as tenuous as Hoke's 2011 luckfest. None of the 6 losses were competitive (we never had the ball with even the chance to tie in the 4th quarter in any single game) and we squeaked out a number of wins that could have gone either way against bottom tier BIG teams (Illinois, Indiana, etc). The games were at least exciting, but I imagine there would have been a severe season ticket erosion of the type we saw in late Hoke.

The Hoke hire never should have occurred. The perfect candidate was out there, wanting to "feel the love," according to Bacon. He never did. Now he has and the AD is in a much better place. 

saveferris

August 6th, 2015 at 1:58 PM ^

Firing Rich Rodriguez in 2010 may have been a foregone conclusion by the end of the season, but fire him in favor of an equivalent or better candidate.  Firing him to hire Brady Hoke, who even at the time he was hired seemed an underwhelming choice is what makes no sense.  If you're not intent on upgrading the head coaching position, then stick with what you've got.  Of course this is not the criteria that Dave Brandon used when following through with The Process.

Needs

August 6th, 2015 at 2:22 PM ^

Things were badly broken enough by the end of 2010 that change was necessary. As ugly as things were last fall, I honestly think that a 4th Rich Rod year would have been worse. I think Rich Rod's a better coach, obviously, but things were just so poisonous at the end of that season, the defense was so bad, and Rich Rod had entered into such a state of desperation (remember "I want to be a Michigan Man" at the Groban banquet). Add in Brandon at the height of his arrogance and it's hard to comprehend. Can you imagine what the recruiting would have looked like? Even given The Process, I think that outcome was better than waiting a year,

Hoke was obviously a failure, but he did at least resuscitate recruiting in a way that I don't think Rich Rod could have.  And by the time his failure was fully realized, the Brandon issues were much clearer than they were in 2010.