I wouldnt mind if we went 6-6 at that point as long as we demolish MSU and beat OSU
landing spot. will be interesting to see how he does.
I wouldnt mind if we went 6-6 at that point as long as we demolish MSU and beat OSU
I think if we can start 4-0, we should win 8 games. Mostly because that would require us to get ND without falling apart. If we can do that, we're at least on the right track.
I was listening to 97.1 and Velanti was talkin bout his UM "friend" doesnt like Rodriguez and wants him gone. He then went on to say that MSU is better than Michigan. Eh.
I think Michigan beats ND and MSU. I'll be realistic and say OSU beats Michigan.
would be interesting to see how he changes his tune if msu is 2-2 and Michigan is 3-1 heading into that game.
I wonder if his friend is named Poole1Dan.
I got that
He didnt just say that MSU was better, he said they were head and shoulders above M. He acted like we were a MAC team that will get annihilated when we play. Why do sparty's conviently forget that they've beat us 1 time in god knows how long, against the worst team in M history, and they lose their starting QB and RB(who happened to be their only offence), and they act like their now an elite team. Its disgusting.
Although this is invoking the rath of michigan hating gods, I cant't see us going into el anythan 3-1.
And for a young team, that loss to notre dame may prove something of value. I actually prefer them losing to notre dame, correcting their mistakes, and using it to win in east lansing.
"I actually prefer them losing to notre dame, correcting their mistakes, and using it to win in east lansing."
You're insane aren't you. (Or drunk.)
I tend to think there is some redeeming value in a freshman team correcting their mistakes in a big game?
And I tend to think you can learn from mistakes you make in a game you win.
If we can't beat ND in the Big House then we won't really have a shot against Sparty on the road.
But hey that's just me.
Perhaps only because of coaching or lack there of on Jaba's part, but based on talent ND is clearly a better more Senior laden team than MSU
And if we couldn't beat Appalachian State, we had no prayer of beating Tim Tebow and Florida in a de facto road game . . . oh wait.
Sometimes teams can improve as the season goes on.
And why do those mistakes that need correcting necessarily have to come after a loss? I like correcting mistakes after each down, each possession, and each half. I also really like correcting mistakes after VICTORIES over ND.
And wtf is this "freshman team" stuff about, anyway?
Take this for what it is, but Mel Kiper said that he thinks Notre Dame will go 11-1, and Joe Schad has ND ranked at 15, in his preseason rankings.
Charlie Weis, at a presser today, said that Clausen, Floyd, and Tate have been running drills with each other for 8 hours a day.
He also said they have experience on their side now, which is true.
I'm not saying I agree with Mel Kiper, or Joe Schad, because I don't. I do think they are going to be much improved from last year though, and hard to beat.
(Side note - I just found out that a family friend of mine, someone I grew up with, is dating Dayne Crist, back up qb for ND. My first comment to her mom was to make sure she doesn't let her daughter get too close to Charlie, just in case he was hungry. She laughed, so did I.)
Because I'd trust that mop more than Mel himself.
I hear you, though. Dame should be better. Emphasis on should. They have some weapons, though I think their running game needs to be a lot better if they want go 11-1.
That record would likely put them in discussion for BCS title game, I would think. I just don't see them winning 6-7 of the games with USC, @Mich, State, BC, @Pitt, UConn, or @Stanford. I think they'll go 5-2 at best, but likely 4-3 in those games.
Anytime espn (or any sports website for that matter) makes a comment about ND they make money. If they say we suck the ND fans all chime in for some reason thinking that they're actually making a difference. If they say we're awesome, the rest of the country chimes in to say the website is wrong, like its actually going to make a difference.
Either way espn wins, so I have always hard time reading any articles on espn's website about ND. If its about a specific player or coach it can become interesting but when they speak about ND in general it just comes out as a bunch of hot air.
Congratulations, you have an "in" with what will be ND's 9th Heisman winner :)
If Kiper thinks the Irish will go 11-1, they probably won't break 8 wins.
you can only hope :)
"Charlie Weis, at a presser today, said that Clausen, Floyd, and Tate have been running drills with each other for 8 hours a day."
Throwing fades and flys no doubt.
If we beat ND, Charlie will be gone at the end of the season. Only a win over USC would save him.
Can we beat Western first then we'll worry about Notre Dame, MSU, etc...
But I'll play along in your silly hypothetical. If we're 4-0, I can easily see 8-4 and an Alamo bowl birth.
Right. Let's make sure we beat Western. They're pretty good and can't be overlooked.
If PSU and OSU both get BCS berths, we might be able to get to the Capital One Bowl again with an 8-4 record.
That can't happen because we'd have a 4-4 record in the Big Ten. It's almost a lock that Iowa, Illinois or (gulp) MSU will have at least a 5-3 record.
That doesn't necessarily matter. Bowls aren't required to take the best available team in a conference. For example, I believe that the Capital One bowl gets the first selection from the Big Ten after BCS berths. That doesn't mean that they have to take the highest ranked team in a conference. An 8-4 (4-4) Michigan would draw a bigger crowd than a 8-4 (5-3) MSU and that's all they care about.
A team can be chosen over one with a better conference record if the latter is only one game better. (BTW, why are we assuming all those teams will go 5-3, anyway?)
Woo hoo! Capital One Bowl!
Any other year besides these last two, and this would be obvious sarcasm. So sad.
I don't understand all this overlooking stuff. We are fans, we're supposed to overlook and over-analyze. Now, we want the team to be focused on WMU, but the fans, we have no impact on the games by over-analyzing right now.
THANK YOU. I've always hated it when people have told me not to look past a game. As if my thought process any given week has anything to do with Michigan's football team.
but this thread is asking for peoples expectations if we start 4-0. It's a hypothetical situation, and in this hypothetical situation we beat Western. So, we don't have to worry about beating Western because, like I said, this is a hypothetical situation.
But since he mentioned ND in the heading, he's making it sound like we will definitely beat Western. We most likely will, but they have a pretty good team.
....when we beat ND!
Then the defense is playing better than anyone expected, Tate and the rest of the offense is at least functional, and some other coach will be needlessly placed on the "hot seat" to replace RR. Oh yeah, and the Spartans will be freaking out, no matter what they may say, because UM will be back on its way to being a major player in the Big 10.
seriously tho, if we're good enough to be 4-0....
one win between MSU and Iowa
Del St + Pur = Win
Ill + Wisc (gonna suck) = 1 win
Maybe a win over PSU or OSU since they're both at home...
8-4? I'll have a glass of maize kool-aid and say 9-3
I do not like the premise or direction of this thread. Ya, I said it.
Western scares the hell out of me and I won't even think about this question until we are 3-0.
Everyone needs to get their heads in the game! Looking ahead is death!
Serious question: Why does Western scare the hell out of you? Just because we're lost to bad teams before, or because you think they will actually be a decent team?
If it's just the paranoid "we lost to Toledo so we can lose to anybody" feeling, then fine. But WMU is not going to be good and we are not going to lose to them.
Looking ahead is death if the players and staff start doing it. we are fans, our contribution to a game is simply making noise and supporting the squad unconditionally. As fans we have every right to kill off-season downtime with "what if's".
we will beat western, maybe not in overly impressive fashion, but i have high hopes and a lot of faith in the ground game this year. re-watch (youtube) some of the plays mcguffie had against ND last year...I honestly think we'll have 250+ yards on the ground. goldie tate and his pals can't burn a thin secondary deep while sitting on the sideline.
outside of mesko getting hurt, i can't think of any other way the cards could have been more stacked against the team last year. they were in the midst of the "broken down" stage of the barwis regime, now they are "built back up". qbs both with zero game experience who were ill-equipped to run a system they had never run (i understand forcier has no games under his belt, but he is by far more equipped to run this show). minor hurt the first half. warren hurt all year. the total lack of a single focus for the defense.
this team (again, outside mesko) will improve in every single aspect of the game this year.
to hell with ND. they were 7-6 and of those 13 games, every assfuck idiot pundit is pinning high hopes on them because of hawaii. hawaii? fuck that. they have to try and breakdown a michigan team on film, of which they will have one game to look at (western). it will not be the same hand-cuffed play calling or mechanical speed they played against last year.
i EXPECT to beat notre dame. we all should.
I like the way you think!
This is what I've been saying. All of the myriad problems that had to come together to make 3-9 happen will not be repeated. I expect to start 5-0 and in impressive fashion. ND sucked and beat a terrible, terrible Hawaii team. The Irish have a few offensive play-makers, but their defense will get shredded (just like last year). State will struggle to score.
As I keep saying, what happened last year didn't turn Michigan into Indiana. The team is still loaded with talent. LAST YEAR was the growing pain.
Whew, you sound like your frothing at the mouth after that :)
I don't think we "sucked" last year but were weren't a BCS team by any stretch of the imagination. (and if we sucked how would you describe UM last year? :) ) If it makes you feel better we are pretty excited about this years defense, the secondary looks really strong, and our DLine has put on some great weight. Just one example but our starting Dtackle can now "clean and jerk" 400lbs (holy shit). Add that to our veteran LBers and Tenuta's defensive play calling and this will be a pretty exciting defense to watch.
Your offense comments are just bad, a QB who can make any throw on the field (and may even be able to scramble now OMG), 2 count them 2 deep threats who were a freshman and sophomore, plus a freshman all-american TE and a run game, yes we will have a run game this year. Yeah just a few play makers, lol.
Your optimism is mostly about intangibles. The secondary "looks strong", the defensive line is putting on "great weight", and they get back some linebackers who really weren't that good to begin with. As for the offense, well, they were just plain bad. They couldn't make any headway against Michigan State's very mediocre defense last year. And where is the running game come from? You say they have a run game, but where is it?
I'm sorry, but if Notre Dame was going to show any signs of progress with their star studded classes, it should've been more than a victory over perennial powerhouse Hawaii. So much talent and so little production is indicative of one thing: poor coaching. As long as Charles is in charge, Notre Dame will not be a serious contender.
I wasn't going into detail because I didn't want to side track the thread and didn't think anyone was that interested. But here we go,
Current Starters as of today (early depth chart was released today)
CBs: Darrin Walls returns after being off for a semester, started only 5 games in 2007 had one pick for 6 . He has totaled 36 tackles, 2.5 for loss and 10 pass break ups in with only 13 total starts. He is now a JR at ND with 2 years of eligibility left, he secured his starting position after spring practice alone. Also Phil Steele has him rated as the 15th best corner in the nation and if there is a someone you can believe in ratings it is Steele.
Robert Blanton played in 12 games last year, totaled 26 tackles 2 passes defended and 2 picks. And he did not start all of those 12 games.
Safeties: Kyle McCarthy is the SS and led the team in tackles last year with 110, 3.5 tackles for loss and 2 picks. He started all 13 games last year I believe. He will be the lone senior in the secondary.
The starting FS will be will be Harrison Smith who is changing positions from last year. (Also rated 15th by Steele at the free safety position) Don't worry, his natural position is at safety. As a sophomore at OLB he tallied 57 tackles 3.5 sacks, 5 tackles for loss, and 7 pass break ups.
Alright so that doesn't mean anything without a comparison, so the first CB taken in the draft was Malcolm Jenkins, he totaled 34 tackles, 1 sack and 3 picks in 2008.
The first safety taken would have been Taylor Mays had he gone into the draft, his 2008 stats included 53 tackles, 2 tackles for loss and 9 deflections.
So now take all of those stats add a year more in strength and conditioning, along with the very favorable comparisons above and my "Looks strong", "makes sense". I am not going to go through each unit and justify my remarks, I can already hear people falling asleep. So just take my remarks with the thought that I have made them with similar stats in mind in regard to each unit.
The Great Weis Whale put together back-to-back-to-back elite recruiting classes (2006-2008)...many of those players are at the point of contributing. I assume ND will be quite good this year and we've seen Weis put together a couple of good seasons with great players. With their soft schedule this year I think they could surprise some people.
But, I have to agree. They should be good this year, if they aren't, god help us all; that would mean Weis gone, which is a scary thought when you consider who they'd bring in (or try to).
When did the clean and jerk become worth points?
If ND is ever going to be able to run the ball under Weis, this is the year to show it. I'm not saying it won't happen, but you sound more confident than I would. When was the last time he coached a team with a solid running game?
Yep it is put up or shut up for the run game which is why I wanted to keep it brief. 2005 and 2006 ND did a good job running the ball (Walker with 1196yds 4.7 per carry, and 1267yds with 5.0 per carry respectively).
So what did he have that made him successful? It wasn't blazing speed or huge size. It was the entire offense around him, veteran Oline, and an awesome passing attack which kept defenses honest. The 2005 and 2006 teams have a lot of similarities and thats a good thing, if your a ND fan.
Like losing all your big games? ZING!
hey Ron English is beast. we can't overlook him
my prediction will remain un changed.
that we go 1-1 against ND/MSU.
If we lose to ND (which is a real possibility: talent, experience, etc.), I bet that lights a fire under the team and we beat MSU, which is the next rivalry/big game on the schedule after ND.
On the other hand, if we beat ND, starting out 5-0 just seems too good to be true.
Is it possible? Yes.
Would I be thrilled? Hell yes!
But I'd also be thrilled if 4-1 to start the year actually pans out, and dont' want to get my hopes up too high.
Notre Dame is penciled in at 10-2, worst case scenario. Apparently we don't need to play the game then.
No they scare me because I fee they are a good team. Anything can happen in the first game. We know that. I rather start off with EMU.
Anything can happen on a football saturday....Do i need to name the examples? Western won the mac last year and beat an illinois team which destroyed us...we WILL be much improved but we cant simply give us an easy win. I have use winning, but i havent looked past the big possibility that we drop our third consecutive season opener. Our Secondary was shaky at best last year and was lit up time and again. We lost two of our most experienced players in the secondary and i just cant trust them enough to stop Miller from puting up big numbers. He is a great quarterback and has a decent RB to back him up. Once again before everyone starts freaking out about this, I still think we will win. But it wont be an easy win and noone should simply brush this off as a simple win. Three years ago i would have laughed about even thinking we could lose to western, but this isnt a normal michigan team. If this game was a few games later in the season i would be a little less skeptical, but with so many question marks, you just cant ever be sure....
also got their doors blown off by rice so...
yes but they still beat illinois...and rice was a 10-3 team-I know its still rice ... western beat two teams that we lost to last year..u cant get past that.
"western beat two teams that we lost to last year..u cant get past that"
And what does THAT have to do with this year?
i was talking to the guy who said they also got blown out by rice...and that means that this isnt some bullshit team...
Who is Miller?
Western got worse and Michigan got better. You're comparing 2008 Western to 2008 Michigan. It doesn't work that way.
Miller is westerns QB who throws for 350 yards a game...he is on the list for best QB in the country..he is good, our secondary is young and unproven..that can mean bad things
I'm stealing this KNOWLEDGE from chitown - but Hiller, according to YPA, was middle of the pack in the MAC last year. He dinks and dunks a lot...similar to the overrated Purdue QB's of seasons past like Painter and Orton. The guy AVERAGED 43.5 passing attempts PER GAME last year. If you are throwing that much you're going to have a lot of yards. He's not as frightening as people think.
Plus he doesn't scramble at all which is a bonus for Michigan.
Hiller threw for 3,725 yards (286.5 ypg) last year. That's a lot. But most of those yards went to players who are now gone: WRs Jamarko Simmons (1,276 yards) and Schneider Julien (712 yards) and TE Branden Ledbetter (464 yards) are all graduated. I wouldn't be surprised if they had some difficulty replacing all of them, especially early in the season.
Perfect opponent then aren't they? Gerg will get to see the D's strengths and weaknesses immediately. And, if Western's D is as bad as I think it'll be, then Michigan should be able to put some points on the board.
I think a lot of you are underestimating Notre Dame. Offensive wise, they are where we will be in 2011. They have a decent to good qb, two top WR's, good Rb"s. The only thing is the offensive line is questionable. Their defense is going to be ok, not great. Our secondary is so thin, that if Turner and Witty do not make it, we be playing walk ons. If any of the starters get hurt, this defense is in a lot of trouble. Notre Dame is going to throw a lot. Michigan should be able to run the ball, but will it be enough?
I can see UM going 5-0 to start the season and 9-3 for the year. I originally thought they would lose to Wisky looking ahead to OSU, but Wisky sorta isn't Wisky anymore.
I just want to see them beat ND, MSU, and OSU. If they are good enough to do that, the rest of the season will take care of itself.
If Michigan starts 4-0 the remaining season will see Michigan winning some and losing some.
As long as we beat 2 of our 3 rivals (ND, MSU, OSU) and make a bowl, I would consider the season an amazing success.
Western doesn't just have a future NFL draft pick returning at QB. They also have four returning starters on the offensive line and a returning 1000-yard rusher. In other words, we probably won't be getting much pressure on the QB and they aren't going to be one-dimensional. They have lost a couple of big receivers, but receiver is probably the easiest position on the team to replace. Plus, an experienced QB and good offensive line can make mediocre receivers look like stars. We are going to have to outgun them and that makes me nervous.
Assuming we are 4-0 at the end of September, I think conservative prediction is 3-5 the rest of the way, 7-5 overall. That assumes beating Del. State and Purdue at home, and either Iowa or Wisco on the road. An upset of PSU or OSU, plus another road win at Iowa/Wisco or MSU gets us to 9-3. 10-2 isn't even out of the question.
Assuming we beat ND. If we're not good enough to beat them at home, then the rest doesn't necessarily follow. If we are 3-1 going into East Lansing, then I can see 6-6 or 7-5 happening.
This is getting frustrating. How many days until the first game again?