I was always a huge Lloyd Carr supporter, and I think Dantonio is going to be a solid coach for MSU after a few train wreck decades. I am sick of listening to these MSU lackies, though, declaring him a saint and talking about UofM like they are all of a sudden the little brothers in the state. Dantonio seems to me like he will be what Lloyd Carr was for all but 1 year of his career: a solid coach and good guy, likely to run a clean program, be a father figure / good influence for his players, recruit well, win 7-10 games every year and occasionally contend late for a big ten championship. A good career, but hardly elite. RR is a lot of things, but I definately think that he will have us contending for national championships (top 10 in nation) at least every couple of years, and will probably win at least one in the next 5-7 years. Still a big step above MSU and Dantonio and will win more games than they lose against those Spartan choads.
Dantonio a new Carr?
Lloyd Carr was always a classy guy. We've already seen a few instances of Dantonio behaving childish. Such as the comments about how tall Mike Hart was, the moment of silence, the list could go on.I don't think I can even imagine Lloyd saying anything like that, EVER.
Maybe Dantonio will be like Lloyd Carr's winning records in the future, but I certainly wouldn't compare him to how classy Lloyd Carr was as a person/coach.
Carr was as good an example of what a coach should behave like as I've ever seen. The game seemed to pass him by a little bit toward the end, but you're right, he could never be accused of missteps as far as the media or his behavior goes.
This is evidenced by the fact that I've never heard a State fan say anything bad about him. That's pretty impressive if you think about it. The only group I've ever heard criticize him is OSU fans, but even then it was because they dominated the series for a while before he retired.
but you're right, he could never be accused of missteps as far as the media or his behavior goes.
You're joking, right?
Todd Harris, halftime interview, 2003 Ohio State at Michigan game.
Well, no, I wasn't joking... why would you ask a dumb question like that?
I had forgotten about that, but I believe he apologized later. Anyway, you're right, I should have said, "His missteps with the media or his behavior were incredibly few and far between."
(JG2112 glares at BlockM and then walks to the locker room. John Saunders berates JG2112 during the halftime show).
the next week at the same point in the game, declaring, "It's great to see you Todd!" with a giant grin on his face.
Oh, Lloyd, you rascal.
'Twould have been more decent had the media goon been hung, drawn, and quartered by the illustrious Mr. Carr himself. Place the bits on the poles lining the stadium as a warning to the rest.
Carr's personal integrity was terrific, and we knew he'd never embarass the school. But he tended to regard the media as a threat, rather than a potential asset, and was more secretive about his program than he needed to be. He definitely got that from Bo (who got it from Woody). Ah, nobody's perfect.
Does anyone realize just how sucsesful Carr was? If Dantonio's record is anywher close to Carrs he will be the 2nd best Coach in the Big Ten hands down. Sparty hasn't won a Big Ten title in 20 years. And Carr won 5 in 12 years, he finished worst than 3rd in the confernce 1 time (his 2nd year) Seriously folks, 5 BCS bowls. Basically one every other year. Agian State has gone to exactly 1 BCS bowl in the last 43 years. I know this has a lot to do with the program, but come on. If Dantonio had the exact same winning percentage as Lloyd, he would easily go down as the greatest Spartan coach of all time.
The BCS has only been around for 10 years...
you know the deal, dont be an ass. rose. plus good enough to be invited to another major bowl.
have the same record in 12 years as Carr, I would have been disappointed, not pleased No one has more integrity IMO than Carr, and he was successful, but there were too may 4 loss seasons and disappointing endings for my taste.
He seems very intense. Yeah I think they will win 7-10 a year but he will not be as good as Carr was.
for use of the word choad.
I always thought it was "chode."
I was thinking specifically that he would be a good but not great football coach, but I might have been reaching to compare his integrity and that of his program to Lloyd's.
I think his integrity has been shown to be lacking. Welcoming a player directly back from the PRISON to the field?
Somehow I'm not feeling it.
And as noted earlier some of his comments have been completely classless. And tasteless. Did Lloyd ever do anything like him re: the comments about Hart and Bo?
End of discussion
immature HS prima donna athlete who has a false sense of self importance. The lack of professionalism and maturity (ie bickering with Hart, anti-UM responses) are further indications that Dantonio is good for MSU... as he will continue doing a good job in further magnifying the "inferiority complex" of little brother in EL.
so... good for Sparty, better coach than they have had, but he has many, many limitations.
Yeah, 'cause its not like anybody in our fanbase is obsessed with Sparty and their head coach or anything.
Did I miss the relevance to the previous two posts or did you just fail?
The whole "inferiority complex" thing is laughable considering just how often we as Michigan fans seem to rehash the same bullshit day after day when it comes to Sparty. Many in our fanbase are just as obsessed with them as they are with us.
But I would make a bet that many fans, and members on this board... are... "bored", and excited, and antsy for the season to start... Quite honestly, I dont believe we will have to wait very long for Dantonio to provide "additional" demonstrated evidence of the Sparty inferiority complex... its just a matter when, not if.
My thoughts exactly. This whole Sparty meme has gained considerable momentum only in the past few months, and I think it's just because we're all BORED. All of the threads about who is our "real" #2 rival etc. just feed the fire.
Why is this negged?
We talk a lot about Sparty on here, maybe more than Ohio State.
Also, Lloyd Carr would not force his whole team to pray together after a game on national TV.
You know, the whole separation of church & state thing. Shouldn't see that at a public university.
To be fair, we have no idea if Dantonio forces them to pray. My guess is that it's optional, just as it is at any other school.
The guy is not like Carr. His W-L might end up being like Carr but Carr had integrity and class, something Dantonio doesn't have at all.
if he's winning 10 games every year at Michigan State. MSU is a stepping stone job.
He will retire as Sparty's head coach.
as Sparty's head coach, but he is the perfect fit for MSU. And I think he is great for the rivalry, so I hope he stays there for a long time.
Charlie Weiss is not a good "fit" for anything man-made.
Like a chair?
Who said "man made"? We're talking about Notre Dame here, everyone knows ND was created through Divine Intervention.
You just made me spit on my keyboard involuntarily. The monitor was only spared because I wasn't drinking anything at the time. Damn, that was funny!
I'd never make that assumption about an MSU football coach. They have a trigger-happy history.
Well he is up there in age and he seems to really embrace MSU.
I think he more embraces the head coaching job at a place with more media attention and more of a rivalry with the target of his penis envy.
Yeah, I said it. Mark Dantonio has penis envy of Michigan.
I don't know if wants to stay there long-term or not, but given Sparty's history, I wouldn't assume they'll let him finish out his career. Right now he's popular, but MSU's athletic department seems perpetually convinced that the 1960s are right around the corner and MSU is destined to return to national prominence. If Dantonio never wins a Big Ten title, and his teams start performing worse than RR's, his job security could become shakier.
Past Michigan State Coaches:
John L Smith '03-06
Morris Watts '02 (interim)
Bobby Williams '00-02
Nick Saban '95-'99
George Perles '83-94
Muddy Watters '80-82
Daryl Rodgers '76-'79
Denny Stolz '73-'75
Duffy Daugherty '54-'72
Duffy Daugherty was the last Michigan State head coach to retire, and he was forced to retire by the administration after going 27-34-1 in his last 6 years.
Who would have thought that Saban would have left MSU to go to LSU? At the time (and forever before), LSU was average or worse (7 SEC championships in 63 years prior to Saban).
Who would have thought that Rich Rodriguez would have left his alma mater West Virginia?
How about Gary Moeller and his circumstances? etc., etc.
After all of 2 years at MSU and an overall record of 16-10, the past history of coaches at MSU, and the ever-increasing mobility of college coaches these days, the odds that Mark Dantonio "retires" are quite small, IME.
The big difference is that Dantonio's family actually enjoys living in East Lansing. Supposedly, Saban's wife hated it here in Michigan.
- Money talks (Dantonio gets offers elsewhere)
- Shit happens (Moeller factor, poor record, etc.)
- It's PR, and the weather elsewhere or alma mater beckons and he's gone
Keep in mind that Dantonio has been helped by the inattention (for the lack of a better word that I can think of) of the last couple of Carr years and turmoil of transition of the RR years. This might carry him through, it might not.
But history seems to show that coaching MSU is a tough gig.
Perles was fired, but I'm pretty sure he just gave up after that.
began serving an 8 year term as a member of MSU's Board of Trustees starting January 1, 2007.
I wish I could "give up" as elegantly (and profitably) as that.
He wants to run for governor next year.
They are both perfect for each other. The only job he leaves for is Ohio State, if that every comes an option for him.
must have used Cash For Clunkers.
Whatever the case, I can't stand the guy. He has no Hart, which could really take a person a Long way.
no no. don't apologize...that was awesome.
Made me double-over and puke.
I can't believe I'm saying this, and I probably deserved to get neg-bombed... but Jim Tressel has more class than Dantonio.
You would never see Tressel making the comments that Dantonio makes, and everyone knows that Dantonio's hatred for Michigan is an act. The guy is a clown, just like all the other MSU coaches from the past.
After a reporter asks Dantionio who he will be rooting for in the 2008 mich/osu game (If Mich wins MSU had a chance to split the Big Ten Championship:
State was playing for a split title even after Michigan lost to tOSU.
But, MSU needed Michigan to win to get a shot at their first Rose Bowl in 20 years, and he says "Go Buckeyes" when asked directly about the possibility.
(Seriously, does ANYBODY give a shit about Pasadena anymore? I'm sure Lloyd still does.)
I give a shit about Pasadena, I've always thought of the Rose Bowl as our annual target.
And not to nitpick (actually, yes, to nitpick) the exact quote was "go bucks".
Going to the Rose Bowl is nice, but I think that winning the Big 10 is more important than what bowl you end up in (unless said bowl is the BCS title game).
I've heard this line of reasoning several times now, and the idea that the outcome of the Michigan-OSU game had no impact on Sparty or D'Antonio's resume is blatantly false!
If Michigan had won, Michigan State would have been OUTRIGHT Big Ten Champions with a victory over Penn State. They would have earned a berth in the Rose Bowl!
With the Ohio State victory, however, they were then forced to be playing for the split title to share with OSU after a potential win over Penn State.
With the OSU victory, OSU held a head-to-head victory, so they would have won the tiebreaker to go to the Rose Bowl. Meanwhile, MSU would have jumped up to #10-12 in the BCS rankings with a win over Penn State (MSU was #15 prior to the game) and it is tough to say whether they would have received an at-large BCS berth.
In context of the OP, last time I checked:
The Rose Bowl, Big Ten Championships, and BCS Games are things in which Lloyd Carr would be very much interested.
If so, does he have Les Miles?
...." at the end, the dark alley shines on the yellow wall.."
What the hell does that mean?
it means "at the end of the dark alley appears the yellow wall."
This may be too small to read, but I don't want to make it any bigger.
It is actually a reference to the Südtribüne at Westfalenstadion:
it's a rough tranlsation of "at the end of the storm, theres a golden sky" from "you'll never walk alone" by gerry and pacemakers
my god, bvb references on mgoblog?
did you watch the koln match?
I didn't feel like giving the full explanation.
And yes, I did watch the game...it should never have been that close. I also watched the Moenchengladbach vs Bochum game (helluva fightback by Bochum).
I DVR most of the games on GOLTV and FSC, and watch them throughout the week.
Sad. I know.
Also...heard a rumor that Subotic may be headed to Arsenal (to replace Toure). It pains me to think he could be playing for the USMNT right now.
I heard another rumor that Schalke's Jermaine Jones (!) may end up eligible to play for the US within the month.
subotic's agent and bvb both denied the arsenal rumor, btw
and i do the same with the dvr
goltv has the bvb-hsv game this weekend
The translation should be "At the end of the dark alley shines the yellow wall".
Edit: Ahh beat to the punch but I do think it's more of a shining than an appearing.
Dantonio is a good coach and I do believe he will have similar success to coach Carr. But, IMO Michigan State will enjoy about 2 of those seasons until Dantonio packs up and heads off to a better program.
OK, I don't think it's fair to compare Dantonio to Lloyd in any way.
I know we had some frustrating moments in the Carr era, but can we step back and remember that our nation's best winning % actually increased during the Carr era? He won a national title.
Michigan State will not, in any way, shape or form, reproduce Michigan's success from 1995-2007 on or off the field.
If, in 13 seasons, Dantonio has ANY of the following, I will quit whatever my job is and go to State to get a journalism degree in their consensus #1 journalism school for journalism and spend the rest of my days hanging out with Valenti:
(1) 122 wins
(2) 5 big ten titles
(3) 1 national championship
he is a two-bit windbag. Dont buy into the media MSM tounge bath of this guy who was rooting against his own team's self interest.
Lloyd was always above it all. Dantonio is down in the gutter.
Just because he is the media's new it-girl doesnt make him anything like Lloyd, who despite his faults was a gentleman as a coach and opponent.
Let's hold back on anointing Dantonio a savior until he actually makes MSU a consistent threat to make BCS games and challenge for the Big 10 title, let alone win a National Championship. I think he is a good coach, but I see him being far more like a Kirk Ferentz than a Carr - maximizing the talent he is able to recruit, but lacking that ability to score the top-notch players (and employ a top-flight offensive system) to consistently be an upper-echelon team.
Nope, he will never win multiple BigTen championships and/or a national title.
You've been reading too much Drew Sharp (WARNING: Drew Sharp).
For those of you who've made a solemn promise to yourself to never click a Freep link again until the ass-clown is gone, allow me to summarize the point of Sharp's column today (WARNING: Drew Sharp):
Yet on the same day, Mark Dantonio welcomed back a running back freshly released from a four-month jail term for hospitalizing a hockey player during a campus fight last fall. Dantonio placed unspecified restrictions on the player's return, reminiscent of Lloyd Carr's private penal policy at Michigan, and the actions barely raised a public ripple.
(I warned you)
So, yes, OP and Drew Sharp, Dantonio is a lot like Lloyd Carr, because Lloyd Carr was all about welcoming back players who had been in jail for causing head damage to a member of the hockey team. Unlike Flashy Flashy RR, who discovers drug dealers in his ranks and dismisses them from the team. Dantonio comes from a more ho-hum, Lloyd Carr-ian age, when *yawn* players alternated time between the state penitentiary and the football field, and punishment for violating team rules or federal law was handled in-house between the coach and the player.
Oh, wait, that's not Lloyd Carr. That's Bobby Bowden!
Any coach, including Dantonio, who has great success at MSU will take a better job. Until the MSU administration decides it wants to do what it takes to be a truly elite program, they will not keep a great coach for very long.
For example, what if, under Dantonio, MSU wins ten games each of the next two years and beats SEC teams in both of its bowl games? I would imagine that Dantonio would get a great offer from an SEC school tired of chasing Florida.
For all we know, he might already be on UT's list to replace Lane Kiffin when his head implodes like a grape.
Ever notice the look on Dantonio's face? Looks like he smells something bad...
Is ask him to look at his feet !!
What Dantonio sympathizer did that???
Must have forgotten "look down at your feet" quote.
else get the Mgoblog community blood boiling or fingers key-board clicking more than a post that references Mark Dantonio?
1) Good coach.
2) I think his passion for State is sincere (one thing he has in common with Lloyd), and I wouldn't be surprised to see him stay
3) I also would not be shocked to I see him jump to a big time opportunity, if it presented itself. He's competitive. He's human. Happens all the time.
4) It will be nearly impossible to duplicate or better Lloyd's records because State is, well, State. Nick Saban could only get so much blood from that stone. Christ, Joe Paterno can't match Lloyd's record (over comparable tenures in the B10). And PSU is a much better program than State, and Paterno is/was every bit the coach Dantonio is (age-adjusted)
Since when is Dantonio getting a new car? I see him as a minivan kind of guy.
Dantonio is probably a Lloyd Carr minus the class, with an inferiority complex and an average of 7-8 wins per year. So, he's not really like Lloyd Carr. You'd have a much better analogy saying Tressel is like Lloyd Carr, as forbidden as that may be. That's a good analogy.
I get the general analogy, with the ground 'n pound type coach and all, but it's not very strong. He also has no chance to make MSU a top tier contender, since he doesn't have the talent advantage that would give him a shot. He hit his ceiling last year, was completely outclassed against good teams, and he doesn't have a good back like Ringer anymore.